I'm sure it can be very tough, & I applaud anyone who can do this. However life is for living, and IF you can afford it, then it is such a waste not to do things that please/excite or give you pleasure (vacations, travel, new clothes/car, whatever).

There are no pockets in a shroud & I want the last cheque I write to bounce! (sorry kids)

1) They can shop at the military's commissary grocery - which is heavily subsidized by taxpayers.

2) They're not having to pay for health insurance (also taxpayer paid).

3) They're not having pay for college (ditto on the taxpayer funds).

When you add up this family's "income", it comes to far more than $14,000.

There's something they aren't telling us in this story. I'm sure they're also recieving a fair amount in taxpayer subsidised food stamps, wic programs, etc. Which as someone else said puts their income above 14k. Based on the clip they certainly aren't starving. I don't have anything against the family. They appear to have a plan, the father is completing his college, and looking for a better paying job. Maybe his experience will give him a bit of humility and empathy for people while he's in his job in law enforcement.

RealAmericansFirst

As a retired military vet, your #1 is incorrect. The commissary is not subsidized by the tax payer at all. It is tax free on food items but everything else is taxed per local economy. And on #2 where in the article does it mention anything about their health insurance?

So "RealAmericansFirst", you are begrudging a man who gets benefits for his military service? So much for putting "real Americans first"

real

1) They can shop at the military's commissary grocery - which is heavily subsidized by taxpayers.

The story doesn't say what his military status is. But since he is applying for a law enforcement job, I would say he is out of the service. That would mean NO COMMISSARY. I'm retired, and I don't use the local commissary. They savings are not that good. Plus you have to pay, the last time I went, a 5% breakage fee. You don't pay that down town.

2) They're not having to pay for health insurance (also taxpayer paid).

Again, if he didn't retire. NO HEATH INSURANCE.

3) They're not having pay for college (ditto on the taxpayer funds).

You are correct on that one, in most cases.

When you add up this family's "income", it comes to far more than $14,000.

No it doesn't, of course the story doesn't say if they get food stamps or not? But that wouldn't mount to "FAR MORE" than $14,000.

@Cappy~ I don't think that was his point was to begrudge, just trying to reflect that the 14k per year may be the cash benefit, not reflecting non-cash benefits.

The unfortunate reality is that there are many, especially on the right that do begrudge people for needing assistance, where demanding that employers pay a living wage is considered "socialism."

I have been where this family is at. Living sub-20k per year, on a variety of assistance programs, raising a family of four, and trying to go to school to better myself, all the while having people look at us with contempt.

The fact is this shows the need of our country to reduce the industrial military complex and to invest in our own country and people. Education especially has the largest economic benefit of all the things we can be doing. We can spend 700B in defense spending not including Homeland Security, all in all we spend over 1T in defense, but 7B in education, according to Republicans, we cannot afford.

The people who resent the benefits we give our returning soldiers, no matter what those benefits may be, make me sick. Tell you what...go out, suit up and fight your own god damned wars.

jmorgan--The republikans need an ignorant uneducated society just to get themselves elected. Of course they are going to shortchange education.

I don't think anyone is resenting the benefits provided to military and former military personnel. I believe the point is to put what they are doing and how they manage in perspective with people who have not been in the military and are also so limited in their income.

I would be interested to know how much is saved by home schooling. I'm way past the age of having kids in school now, but I remember the constant need of having to come up with money for "free" public school this-and-that.

If they own a home they are paying property taxes to support public schools.

@ realamericansfirst...The commissary is funded by a 5% surcharge, which commissary customers pay, not taxpayers. And if the guy is out of the service, he can't shop at the commissary anyway, he gets no Tricare benefits, and when you enlist you pay towards your own GI Bill for the first several months.

My folks did this during the Depression, and continued their lifestyle of 'no waste' when it was not necessary anymore. They passed on this legacy to their kids. We had everything we needed and most of what we wanted. None of us have ever been in debt and we don't spend money we don't have. Our family motto was, 'Use it up, wear it out; make do, or do without.' It works fine, and we have never been needed anything we could not have.

1) They can shop at the military's commissary grocery - which is heavily subsidized by taxpayers.

2) They're not having to pay for health insurance (also taxpayer paid).

3) They're not having pay for college (ditto on the taxpayer funds).

When you add up this family's "income", it comes to far more than $14,000.

I suspect this might have something to do with it, although others have pointed out that Pt. #1 might not be true.

Many of us could make it on $14k/year if living in a low cost of living area, and on the GI Bill.

This is not to say the family isn't doing a good job managing their money where they can. We should all be so frugal. But not everyone, everywhere, can make it on $14k/year (in some places, that won't even pay rent).

While this is a heart-warming story for some, it's not something easily done. And if it were, it rapidly would become more expensive. A lot of these 'savings' are being paid by the taxpayers.

Home schooling to 'save' money? I seriously doubt it. And keep in mind, those library books are paid for by us. If everyone did this, the library shelves would soon be empty.

Making their own cleaners? This is cheap because of low demand for the ingredients. Raise demand, prices will follow.

Own your home? Yeah, let's see you save enough money to buy a house (even a $30K foreclosure) on $14K a year.

While I'll give them credit for managing this, this certainly isn't available to everyone or even most. And just one major medical issue would wipe them out, putting them back to zero, not to mention home or car repair or any of the other 'emergencies' that crop up in peoples lives.

And what are they doing for health insurance? Going without and hoping for the best?

Ok, Crazy Steve...

A lot of these 'savings' are being paid by the taxpayers.

You named the library books, where are the other examples? "a lot"? Doesn't sound like it.

Crazy Steve: I give you the Grinch of the Year award. This family is trying their best not to be a burden to society. Many of us cannot say the same.

Wow, 14K is what we pay our dog Fido for taking the trash out and for being a good boy...plus not messing with the cat

Health insurance???

I doubt it, and the first kid who tries to fly off the garage will bill the taxpayers and end the fairy tale.

Hello folks, for those that are buying into this BS you will believe anything the corporate owned presstitutes will feed you. They want to keep the sheeple in line by continually lowering their expectations. If they can get you to buy this BS they can get the same people to claim that living in a cardboard box is quality living.

The people who resent the benefits we give our returning soldiers, no matter what those benefits may be, make me sick. Tell you what...go out, suit up and fight your own god damned wars.

@RealAmericansFirst didn't criticize veterans' benefits. He was simply pointing out that if this family receives any benefits, then their income was, effectively, more than $14K/yr. That's not a criticism, it is a financial observation.

That is $14K without a house payment. Not counting our house payment our family of three could easily live on $8K a year. If you don't have credit card debt, don't have a car payment, don't have a mortgage, and don't have health insurance, it does not leave much else. You have utilities, home insurance, auto insurance, food, gas. That is it.

They paid cash from savings ( ? how do you save $30,000) for a three bedroom house which at minimum would cost most low income families $800/mo to rent which amounts to $9,600/yr or with the 140,000 they are claiming would really be $23,600/yr.

I applaud their frugality and work ethic...but their situation is not the norm for a young family of four even with the same ethics.

A bunch of these "glorified frugality" stories have come out lately.

This seems to be a concerted effort by the media to "normalize" financial struggles, to make it sound commonplace and cool during the Obama Recession.

God forbid the media promote the fact that 49 million Americans are on food stamps or that 89 million Americans are unemployed or under-employed. Or that Dodd/Frank and other crushing regulations have made it near impossible for regional banks to lend money to consumers and small businesses. Or that worker hours are being cut because small businesses cannot afford Obamacare. Or the payroll tax hike has taken $150/month out of each family's pocket and will for every month henceforth.

That would hurt the media's Narrative about their beloved Obama and his presidency.

No, it's "Make Do with Less! It's Really Cool!"

Something is just not right with this story. I agree that frugality is very useful, but $14,000 is very little cash to have on hand for basics - food, taxes, utilities (vey hot in Summer and cold in Winter), clothing, gas, car maintenance, and most importantly -Emergencies. Also, as a ow income family of four, they managed to save $30,000 to buy a house outright?

Something is missing out of this story.

SO many thing wrong with some of the comments, but I'll stick only a couple.

1. If he served his county in Hell, aka Iraq, then he EARNED every single penny of 'benefits' the "taxpayers" pay out and we should be THANKFUL that he did it so that our sons and daughters didn't have to be drafted to do it instead.

2. She saved that money while he was in Iraq earning his regular pay plus combat pay. It would have been much more than $14k a year.

berry

@RealAmericansFirst didn't criticize veterans' benefits. He was simply pointing out that if this family receives any benefits, then their income was, effectively, more than $14K/yr. That's not a criticism, it is a financial observation.

The problem with you making excuses for him. Is he didn't say "if". He was telling everyone with his bull@!$%# benefits that he thinks all ex-military get.

I admire this family for scraping by.

But you have to realize that a working person "making" $14,000 a year would have 7.65% taken right off the top for payroll taxes. That would leave them $12,929 for a family of four for the year, and that's just not realistic.

My beef is that articles like this trumpet the myth that there are people out there who are able to live decent lives on peanuts by just buckling down. Usually when you look at the whole picture, there's no one who is really getting by on that kind of money.

Then the GOP points to these myths when they want to keep workers from making a real living wage.

Anyone who doesn't support raising the minimum wage has never actually tried to live on it.

RealAmericansFirst

Anyone who doesn't support raising the minimum wage has never actually tried to live on it.

I'm not against raising the minimum wage, but there are minimum wage earners out there that think they are entitled. That 'entitlement' attitude is what gets to me.

Please feel free to disagree with me, but here in the United States, everyone is 'entitled' to a free education. It's what you ultimately do with that education that leads you down the path to your final destination in the workplace.

Study hard. Work hard. You will be rewarded on both counts.

Bill Crane, you hit the "something else" when you mentioned the 30 Large. Most of us have not been able to save that much to turn around and buy a house... no mortgage or Rent which is usually the largest bill for a family. I would love to have an extra grand/mo. I could be living a lot easier!

Making your own soap and hanging up the laundry on clotheslines to dry. Nope. This is the kind of stuff women used to have to do in the 1950s. Getting a damn clothes dryer isn't going to kill you! If you take into consideration the value of the labor that she (and her husband) are having to put into living that way, you'll see that it's much more than $14K.

Who want to go back to the "pioneer" way of life? Most people who actually lived that kind of life wanted nothing more than to get beyond it.

When I was growing up, we lived on a lot less than $14,000 a year. I think that my father's best year ever he earned less than $4,000 cash. Of course we grew a large garden, had nets in the river, ran trap lines, and hunted for meat. The only things we ever bought at the store were salt and coffee. We didn't have electricity, and we heated and cooked with coal picked up along the railroad tracks where it had fallen from the unit trains (gathering that was my job as a small child).

My father had a shop. He bartered with the local farmers, fixing their equipment in exchange for various things we needed that we didn't grow or build for ourselves. We more than got by, we did quite well by our standards, though we had little that was store bought. We always had food on the table, a roof over our heads, and plenty of healthy outdoor activity to keep us busy. We didn't make bad bets wasting money on the rigged game of insurance. My grandmother knew how to make poultices and potions.

By the time I was a teen I had become quite adept at finding ways to make money. I sold furs, peddled fish, bought a couple of old trucks and started a hay hauling business. Etc. By the time I left for Georgia Tech, I'd saved enough money to pay for my degree, no student loans at all. Today, my company has offices around the world. I'm semi-retired. The young folks I hired and trained to run the business are doing well.

Most Americans could live on a lot less than they do if they are willing to work at it, and it is admirable to live within one's means. Still, I think it is legitimate question to ask what they are doing for health insurance. Clearly, they are not purchasing it privately or there would be no way they could live on the amount of money they have. Either they are going without (in which case the rest of us subsidize their very expensive emergency room care if they get sick) or are on Medicaid. I do not have any problem with subsidizing their health care so they can move forward to improve their lives; but, I strongly prefer to do it through Medicaid rather than in the emergency room because Medicaid is cheaper, better care. And, maybe if the kids went to public school, Mom could get a parttime job. Just suggesting an alternative.

I visited Danielle's blog (which is a really great read, by the way), and there is absolutely no mention of medical expenses. So either they receive Government medical care or they are going without medical care.

Please understand that I (and I believe the others that have made this point) am in no way believing that they shouldn't receive paid government medical. In fact I am a strong advocate of Universal Health Care. The point is that $14,000 would go no where nearly as far if they had to pay for medical insurance plus deductibles and co-pays - and that's not even considering the case of being seriously ill or having a "pre-existing condition."

Medical expenses are the #1 cause of all American bankruptcies. Life on a low income is challenging but possible if health care isn't a concern, but virtually impossible for those without health benefits and in less than perfect health.

culheath

They paid cash from savings ( ? how do you save $30,000) for a three bedroom house which at minimum would cost most low income families $800/mo to rent which amounts to $9,600/yr or with the 140,000 they are claiming would really be $23,600/yr.

She probably did the same thing I did when her husband was deployed, they get combat pay (around a thousand dollars) and they don't pay federal taxes just SS and MC, when my husband was deployed I only used what his normal pay was every month and saved everything above that. When he came home on R&R (6 months in) I had already saved almost nine thousand dollars. I was so proud of myself that I started putting a little more every month away at the end of his deployment we had almost 20 thousand dollars. We didn't buy a house but we did pay off all our credit cards and our truck.

Wow ! I see a lot of posts here making excuses for not being frugal and saving money. Or posts attacking the story for how difficult it would be so it CANT be that they can do this without X Y or Z.

You can always make excuses for why IT IS SO HARD ! But that doesn't mean you can't do it. Sadly, for people these days HARD means they aren't going to make the effort.

Make due without cable, smart phones, or even non prepaid phones. These days people keep saying they can't do without instead of doing without.

DaveMMM: It's called laziness. Or, "Why should I do without? I live in the greatest country in the world, and shouldn't have to inconvenience myself in any way."

I find what they have done, and are doing to be admirable. That having been said, as other posters have noted, they are living rent free. This is because of their savings and sacrifice as well; however, a family of four without a fully paid for home would not be able to live well on $14,000/yr. A family of four privately paying medical insurance would not be able to live on either the $14,000 (or the $23,000 income equivalent because of their owning a home.) It is the headline that is misleading and they did not write the headline. I just hope that they are on Medicaid rather than uninsured because this is both better for them and for taxpayers.

They can shop at the military's commissary grocery - which is heavily subsidized by taxpayers.

The Commissary's are only cheaper when not in the 48 states. We shop at Costco it is cheaper than the commissary's and the fruit does not rot in two days.

They're not having pay for college (ditto on the taxpayer funds).

That is part of the package for joining the military. However my wife had 80K of debt when she joined and She still had to pay that off.

They're not having to pay for health insurance (also taxpayer paid).

They most likely did not retire in service and if they didn't then they would get it through a government program that is available to all low income households.

I don't understand how this woman was able to save $30K, when she was bouncing checks & missing paying the bills b/c she had already spent the $ by the time the checks bounced, during her husband's deployment.

I have seen the condition of foreclosures that can be had for as little as $30K. They've usually been vandalized. That doesn't look like a great neighborhood to start, so I would expect it to be even more so. You can't just go in & roll on some cheap $10 Walmart paint over spray paint & damaged wallboard. She's selected *trendy* colors as well, so even the paint didn't come cheap.

So where did they get the $ to fix it up? Granted, it looks like crap on the outside (& even knowing Vega$ can be a pricey place to live, I am appalled that $140K in housing looks like a trailer park), but not on the inside. That kitchen is a recent remodel, you can tell by the countertops. That means the floors either were refinished or replaced; either is an expensive, time-consuming option. Those cutesy word stickers she has plastered on every single wall alone start at a minimum of $20 a pack. It's not furnished out of Goodwill.

Have they been that lucky not to have a major home repair on top of that? It won't last if so.

They live in a desert. Cold nights, scorching hot days, their elec bill must be sky-high. Even w/o a mortgage there are property taxes, scl taxes, & insurance. $14K would make them eligible for HEAP as Nevada (unlike NY) participates in cooling HEAP rather than just opting for heating HEAP.

$14K is also SNAP-eligible (food stamps for those who persist in calling it by a name nigh on 20 yrs old). And this dummy is paying a Costco membership fee! How is that *frugal*? Sounds more like trying to be *posh* to me. Jeez, even Target has lower grocery prices than Costco or Sam's Club. Who pays for the *privilege* of entering a store & spending $ in it?

They must have *good deals* on all the printer ink & paper she wastes on her shopping lists. Seriously? Pencil & paper no longer good enough for Gen X? Who prints out their grocery list? Nice laptop there as well. I bet that file cabinet is crammed full of printouts for her *homeschooling activities*. They should really STOP letting ppl randomly *teach* kids at home w/o proper training & supervision. Scouring websites is not how you teach.

In addition to use of the public library for that as has been pt'd out, it actually costs more for the local schl district to have parents homeschool. They have to, by law, supply the parents w/ textbooks plus copies of curriculum guides & other tchr materials, transport the kids for mandatory standardized testing or pay a substitute teacher to waste a few days going into the home for those, send a visiting nurse to the home for the checkups done in schl, assign someone to keep track of student progress & make the decision as to whether they are ready for the next grade level, extend invitations for field trips, etc, lots of stuff you wouldn't think of....& they don't get the state & federal aid to cover these expenses b/c the kids never set foot in the schls & aren't marked down in the official state & federal attendance register.

At $14K they *may* be eligible for Medicaid for the entire family. I don't know if Nevada is one of the states that also has a state-run health ins program for those caught in the middle (too much income for MA, no ins avail at work & not enough income to buy it privately), but they would definitely be eligible for that if there is one. The difference btwn that & MA is higher eligibility threshold, higher co-pays, & a monthly sliding scale premium. Both would incl dental.

I love how she says *I try not to* when asked if she sticks to her list. Obvs not. Mom is at least a size 24/26. She may be a little bigger. So already she is paying more for her own clothing b/c that's just how it is. More material, more expensive. I don't always fit in a L top b/c of my boob size, & right there it's another $3-5 xtra just to go up to an XL/1X. Obvs she ran out & bought a new outfit when she found out she was going to be on the TV, as that animal print skirt was also *trendy*. Using that clothesline just isn't enough exercise. She could be a lot more frugal if she lost weight. Less grocery expense, less clothing expense.

I noticed her *job* was to *blog*, & supposedly teach kids & be frugal in her spare time. Why isn't she getting off her ass & contributing financially to the household?

She got lucky when her husband returned intact from his deployment. Now he's going into law enforcement. What's she going to do if he gets killed in the line of duty, blog about it?

She is probably making a little bit of $ off that blog if indeed it is so popular (I've never heard of it) that she's getting media attn, just from the pg hits on the ads she selects etc. Could be as much as an additional few $100/mo depending on just how popular, likely unreported income as well, esp if they are receiving any assistance. So their actual income could be $2-3K more than they claim it is.

But it's certainly not enough to support 2 kids & maintain a house. Bloggers are a dime a dozen these days. Everyone thinks if they build a web pg, ppl will come listen to their blatherings & make them rich & famous. Not happening for 99.9% of em.

This whole thing just doesn't ring true. Nevada is hardly a *frugal* state in which to live. In addition to her blogging pittance, they've got to be getting assistance from somewhere, whether public or private. Nobody tells the whole truth about their finances to an online audience.

Oh Scar,

I've so missed hearing from you....the Vine has been lost without you.

Yes,

My family and I re-use toilet paper.

RealAmericansFirst

no doubt a union trogidite. dependent upon what no on their own ability but rather not expectant to do a real job. you complain about minimum wage but what about small business owners that have to pay an over inflated. POS

A true American story. We are fortunate to live in a country where we have the choice to be the pioneers and the tradesmen, the hunters, fishers, and crop producers that our foreparents were. We are big on do-it-yourself projects in our household, too.

One winter the controller in our furnace went out. Instead of paying thousands of dollars for repair, we kept a fire in the fireplace and searched on Craig's List for a new one. We bought it the next day and installed it for around $75.

Max, having a garden is, indeed, a terrific idea. I have had one for years. BUT my garden (along with my neighbors) was horrible this past summer due to the extreme heat temperatures. I was disappointed with my harvest but determined to continue each year.

The main advantages of a garden are not financial. Living in SoCal, I can buy in-season produce at the grocery store fairly cheaply. But between our piss-poor desert soil and extreme summer heat, a vegetable garden is very worky and not that cheap (drip system, soil amendments) A garden does produce prefectly ripe, organic food, but in Vegas, may not be worth it.

Yes, local conditions can make gardening more challenging but IMO it is still worth it. Just growing some greens (lettuce, chard, turnip, and so many others) makes food more healthy and more appetizing. And buying grains and beans in bulk and actually cooking from scratch will save you a ton of money.

Being frugal saves you money but it also saves the Earth.

You might try "straw gardens". We've been researching this a lot and have our straw ready to go for this spring! You can get a lot of produce in a small area and also confine the amount of watering needed.

It's very important to use STRAW bales and not HAY bales.

Thanks for the idea, Beth. I will look into it as well. Good luck!

I make food from scratch and do my best to fix things myself, but I have to work full time, especially since my husband left. Finding time to make soap, sew, or do some of those other things is really challenging when I'm helping 2 kids with homework every night. I use old carpet to keep down weeds in the garden, but some weeds manage to grow anyways. Maintaining a garden takes time, so mine tends to be a bit neglected. They deserve a lot of credit, but not everyone can pull it off the way they do.

Sort of like those who publicize their efforts to live off food stamps for a week.

They ignore the fact that they already have spices, cooking oil, and a lot of backup fixings on hand. And they know that next week they'll have plenty to eat - unlike those who really do it month in and month out.

One winter the controller in our furnace went out. Instead of paying thousands of dollars for repair, we kept a fire in the fireplace and searched on Craig's List for a new one. We bought it the next day and installed it for around $75.

That's not *thousands in repair*. For *thousands* you could get a whole new furnace. It's more like $250 to have a repairman come fix that. Which I did b/c I don't like to trust myself to screw around w/ both gas & elec at the same time. So while you did save $, it was hardly *thousands*.

And not everyone has the luxury of a fireplace so they can leisurely poke around online & explore options. Even tho I've always lived in a *regular* climate (have 4 actual, discernable seasons), I've never had a fireplace & would never want one. Too much work & the risk of burning down the house, no TY.

I read here of big 6+ kids families and whilst I appreciate that in this day and age families can get integrated by 2nd marriages etc. but I am stunned that others allow themselves to have so many kids when they can't afford it.

Well, there is a whole group of people in this country that believe the only type of birth control we should teach our children is abstinence. Just don't have sex. That's like saying, just don't get pimples. Until we have responsible and comprehensive sex and birth control education in this country we will continue to have families that can't feed their numerous children or women opting for abortions from unwanted pregnancies. It really pisses me off that so many of those willing to murder abortion providers also refuse to allow our children to be taught and provided with effective birth control measures. Really. it's a disgrace.

Bluelake, good post, and tx for mentioning that 3 letter word :SEX.

Republicans are obsessed with it, scream about it, want to legislate it, are incredibly ignorant about it (Aiken).....but they sure as hell don't want to pay for anything about it.

Just viagra.

Gee. what are the property taxes on their "new" home. Don't they get money back from the government at tax time because they live below the poverty level? Is this supposed to justify the wage disparity going on in this country? I'm just not buying that a family of 4, who owns a home, is living on a gross income of $14,000. Do they even have health insurance? This is just not the whole story.

That family enjoyed a confluence of factors that made it possible for them to later afford to live on that little.

Most families and individuals in the U.S. -- depending on their personal circumstances and depending on where they live -- aren't so fortunate even if they were frugal survivalists. For example, if you live in a city with cheap rent, you can't be expected to have open acreage to have a garden that will supply enough food for your whole family, unless you live in that rare area in the city limits that's zoned for it.

And if and when they decide to send one of their own to get a college education, continuing to live on $14K for the four of them won't cut it, even with loans; the cost of getting a college education in this country is skyrocketing.

Their family is the exception, and exceptions doesn't make it the rule.

Unfortunately, many right-wingers will see this article, and with their political biases and reluctance to engage in any substantiated fact-checking, will quickly jump to FALSE conclusions, and in their stubborn pride, they'll DOUBLE-DOWN on it. They'll instantly assume that the minimum wage need not be raised, that government-subsidized safety nets for children, single mothers, the handicapped and the elderly aren't necessary, that full-time employment isn't needed, that companies don't have to grant skilled-labor any benefits or health care coverage at all -- given this one, publicized example.

Fox News will put this story through their media echo chambers like the Drudge Report and Breitbart, while Fox News's six-figure commentators will bandy about misleading narratives and repeat hyperbole that will suggest that American families can easily live on even less. "Live within your means, and do more with less," will be their shrill demand, while they live in their ivory towers and earn much, much more, than $14K a year.

So don't be surprised that multi-million-dollar-paid talking heads like Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh will have something to say about it too. They'll broadcast straw-man examples that'll malign all non-Republicans as too lazy and undeserving (with the exception of uber-affluent, Tea Party loving, corporate-conservatives like themselves, of course).

JG, judging from the article I'd say that getting buy is more a matter of what you don't do rather than what you do for clothes, medical, etc. They work hard and get by on their own initiative without expecting the rest of the world to subsidize them. A novel concept to be sure, but they seem to feel good that they are not a burdens to society.

Bluelake, as ridiculous as your comparison of sex and pimples is, as if sex were inevitable and can't be helped, I'd like to point out that in general, conservatives aren't so concerned with people having sex as we are about the fact that you liberals expect the rest of us to pay for the consequences of it. We pay billions in taxes to cover the irresponsibility of others, and we'd rather not. Families like the one in this article represent the relatively few who work hard and get it done, they survive and thrive by making their own choices and paying for them. This is unlike the "pro choice" folks who want people to have free choice, but want others to pay for the outcomes of those choices.

Jogrinder-- When looking at the human race as a whole I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that SEX IS INEVITABLE. The rest of your post is just the usual"liberals want us conservatives to pay for everything" right wing garbage. Just because I want decent and effective sex and birth control education in this country, you assume I'm a liberal. And the conservatives want what? Abstinence only sex education, which, when it fails miserably, has the conservatives saying, "don't look at me I won't pay for it.

Further, your statement that this family represents "the relatively few" who work hard and get it done is just plain ignorant bull@!$%#. Shame on you and your hatred of most working Americans. More right wing, Fox, Hannity and Limbaugh fascist crap!

The idea that sex is inevitable is the garbage. Can you justify your thoughts in a meaningful way? So far you haven't.

I guess you have nothing to stand your ideals on but to scream "More right wing, Fox, Hannity and Limbaugh fascist crap!"

Jogrinder,

Provide fact-checked substantiation for your claims.

It is true that conservatives and their businesses strongly prefer to privatize their profits and socialize their losses. We non-conservatives pay for your losses. Red States take the federal tax revenues, that Blue States, create.

Most Red States Take More Money From Washington Than They Put In

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2011/11/states-federal-taxes-spending-charts-maps

You said that "conservatives aren't so concerned with people having sex..." Not true. Conservatives are indeed concerned about people having sex, as in controlling the products or outcomes of human sexual reproduction. Abstinence programs, anti-abortion legislation, Person-hood proposals, banning Planned Parenthood, etc.

War On Women Continues As Abortion Becomes A Man's Issue

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/28/war-on-women_n_2568696.html

And using this family as the one example to bolster your hyperbole, well, they enjoyed a confluence of factors that made it possible. Exceptions don't make the rule.

...Just sayin'.

...and Bluelake,

Love your posts; I look forward to reading each one of them.

So amusing. The radical right-wingers are allergic to fact-checked substantiations for their outrageous claims. It's one of the major reasons why they lost the last election. They couldn't master the use of the internet as a campaign medium, or as a venue to check anything they assume is true. As Jindal said time and again, Republicans have got to stop saying stupid things.

So ...Give 'em hell!

The Republican Brain: Why Even Educated Conservatives Deny Science -- and Reality

http://www.alternet.org/story/154252/the_republican_brain%3A_why_even_educated_conservatives_deny_science_--_and_reality?paging=off

east coast--- How can you possibly justify your idea that sex is NOT inevitable. The proof is patent! Look around you, our species reproduces, thus sex is inevitable. Duh! For every single human being all the time? Obviously not! But the idea that by hiding sexual urges (urges that are, by the way, also inevitable!) or denying or ignoring or repressing them you can somehow help a child through their years of sexual maturation, is idiotic at best.

And rradiko...thank you and right back at ya. Sooner or later the truth will win out. And speaking of republikan brains...I heard it took them years just to find one.

They work hard and get by on their own initiative without expecting the rest of the world to subsidize them:

I'm not so sure on that. While I certainly don't begrudge the hubby his veteran's benefits, they ARE subsidized by the tax payer.

Since these children are home schooled, they most likely use libraries (admitted), museums, parks, etc. All places subsidized by the tax payer.

And we haven't looked at property taxes yet. The average rate I could find was 1-3%. So let's settle on 1.5%. They said they paid $30,000 for the house but "improved it" and Las Vegas valuations are going up rapidly. So let's say the house is now $40,000. That's a nice chunk off the top for JUST their property taxes. If they qualify for an "exemption" then that's a subsidy.

Are they collecting earned income credit for their kids? With $14,000 they are probably not paying taxes, and so getting more back more taxpayer "subsidy".

Unfortunately the article doesn't mention whether they do, or don't, get other subsidies such as food stamps. Are the kids on Medicaid? Do they use WIC?

So, I'd like to see the article a bit more in depth and addressing these issues and see just how much they live on when all these (and probably other subsidies that I haven't thought of) kick in.

How can you possibly justify your idea that sex is NOT inevitable. The proof is patent! Look around you, our species reproduces, thus sex is inevitable. Duh!

Uh, this isn't what we're talking about and you know it. Are you going out of your way to try to make a non-point. No one here is denying that life is created through sex. No one.

For every single human being all the time? Obviously not! But the idea that by hiding sexual urges (urges that are, by the way, also inevitable!) or denying or ignoring or repressing them you can somehow help a child through their years of sexual maturation, is idiotic at best.

Ok. Now that we can get back to the real debate here instead of your odd tangent that served no purpose... Opps! Here we are again, back to the insults withno real substance. The best you've done is said that repressing sexual feelings is unnatural (at least that's what it seems like you were trying to say but I'm being polite and cutting out the unneeded insults, plus I have real points to make, not just a bunch of nonsense). It's true, repression of sexual desire is unnatural. But even the oh-so-wise government has proclaimed that it is illegal to engage in sexual acts with another until after the 18th birthday. By that time sexual urges are already waning. If we had to repress them for that long and during the most turbulent times I guess we have no problem doing so afterwards. Right?

Many people have had no issue without sexual contact with others. People can do it. We're no dumb animals. I'll agree that fundamental understandings of how human reproduction should be taught but to act like we have no choice in the matter? We're not common dogs. We can keep it in our pants. Thankyouverymuch.

Bluelake, using your logic we have to accept drug and alcohol abuse, rape and murder, and war an violence as inevitable because they are all so prolific. How do you feel about subsidizing war? What I'm talking about is that liberals want me and the rest of us to pay for the outcomes of the very private, very individual choices of individuals who engage in personal private activities. I'm not interested in controlling what others do, just in not making up for their errors in judgement. Not sure where you come up with me hating most working Americans. I am one, and I make good money for the hard work I do. And I pay my way and that of others too. If the day comes when I can't, I hope I hope I have the good sense and grace to take the initiative the family in this article has taken and remain self reliant. I'm not against reasonable taxes and spending for infrastructure and even reasonable social spending, but i do oppose subsidizing poor personal choices. In my job I work with the low income community every single day, and I see the spectrum of those who work hard and sacrifice to earn their keep, and those who waste what they do have on $200 shoes and plasma televisions, and collect government benefits such as the program I manage. I live in that world all the time, so don't tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about -- I look into their faces regularly, and I help them all as my voluntarily funded program is able.

Beth,point taken on my choice of the word subsidize. You can't live in the US, or pretty much anywhere on the planet without utilizing some sort of public resources. My larger point is that, as the article suggests, work hard and remain frugal, being happy with what they have, and not living with an expectation that others are responsible for paying their way. Government taxation and legitimate spending makes sense -- we all pool our resources for the common good, and we all contribute to the whole, in theory. Why should others have to pay for Bluelake's sexual proclivities? If he/she needs decent sex and birth control education, why doesn't he/she pay the market price -- or make the decision to not engage in the behavior of which he/she is not well informed? Do we need to pool our resources to provide for roads and bridges, for a well regulated militia, for police and fire services? Makes sense to me. Do we need to pool our resources so Bluelake can understand the right way to have sex, and to pay for his/her ignorance when he/she doesn't pay attention? I think that should remain in Bluelake's court. The art is in figuring out where to draw the lines between need and desire. For my part, I see a portion of our country enslaved to paying, and another portion enslaved to being provided for by others. This worldview is painted in pretty stark lines, but that's not all I see out there.

Oh and Beth, while I don't recall the article mentioning any Veterans benefits the family is taking advantage of, I'd say they earned those by the husband's service, and family's sacrifice. Difference between freeloading on benefits and earning them.

Oh and Beth, while I don't recall the article mentioning any Veterans benefits the family is taking advantage of, I'd say they earned those by the husband's service, and family's sacrifice. Difference between freeloading on benefits and earning them.

If they are receiving benefits, NO ONE here is criticizing them for it. But, if they are, it is fair for us to know about it because those benefits could make a difference in being able to live on $14K.

A family of four with an income of $14K is eligible for the Earned Income Tax Credit. How much are they getting from the federal government each year?

I admire this family for scraping by.

But you have to realize that a working person "making" $14,000 a year would have 7.65% taken right off the top for payroll taxes. That would leave them $12,929 for a family of four for the year, and that's just not realistic.

My beef is that articles like this trumpet the myth that there are people out there who are able to live decent lives on peanuts by just buckling down. Usually when you look at the whole picture, there's no one who is really getting by on that kind of money.

Then the GOP points to these myths when they want to keep workers from making a real living wage.

Oh and Beth, while I don't recall the article mentioning any Veterans benefits the family is taking advantage of, I'd say they earned those by the husband's service, and family's sacrifice. Difference between freeloading on benefits and earning them.

Well sure ... he's going to school on them. That's the $14,000. And like I said, I don't begrudge them, but just pointing out they are subsidized by the taxpayer. ALL true.

My bigger issue is that I didn't feel the article thoroughly outlined WHAT the family received. I'm POSITIVE they live on more than $14,000/year when you consider they have to pay property taxes and utilities.

He is/was being paid for his service. If you liken this to subsidizing then you are just fueling your agenda of excuses.

What this story points out is that there are a ton of people that will make excuses for laziness but when a success story is pointed out then everybody still wants to tear it down as not being the case. Nobody said it was easy to live frugally and within your means, but so what if it isn't easy? If it isn't easy you aren't going to do it? That's a good work ethic, not.

Dave ... you missed the ENTIRE point of my comment. The story was incomplete.

Just don't have sex. That's like saying, just don't get pimples.

What is wrong with not having sex before marriage? I know many many people that have done that. You want to know something NO one ever had to teach me about condoms they are common knowledge and if you cant put one on right it is because you cant read the basic instructions on the wrapper. We used birth control after we were married for a few years and then had two kids and were using it again.

I'm POSITIVE they live on more than $14,000/year when you consider they have to pay property taxes and utilities

My grandpa's place is valued at 63K in Overtone NV there property tax is 400 a year.

Don't they get money back from the government at tax time because they live below the poverty level?

I forgot about that. They can take the Real Property Tax Credit whether they file income taxes or not. I used to do it for my retired, widowed grandmother & great-aunt who had just their SS checks after their husbands passed on. It doesn't matter if you own or rent, as long as your income & family size fits into one of the IRSs niches, you can get $ back. They used to get a little check for around $300 or so & were quite happy w/ it. Of course this was over a decade ago, one owned her own home mortgage-free & the other pd low rent, so it's likely a higher amt back now, esp for a family of 4.

They can probably also file for that Child Tax Credit thing. I don't know much about it b/c they didn't have that when I had kids to deduct. But I hear it's worth around $1K per kid. That could be incorrect.

If they file income taxes, then they also get an EIC, which for 2 kids is going to be around an xtra $4K right there.

Do they use WIC?

Of course not. WIC is for pregnant women (can't tell if she is or not, but it wasn't mentioned, so let's assume not) & children under the age of 5.

For everyone who talks about it like it's the Holy Grail of Freebies, you've never been on it or you'd know it isn't. It is a limited monthly allotment of milk (which goes down every yr, from whole to 2%, then to 1%, then to skim, the kids won't drink anything below 2% anyway & the lower fat grades aren't thick enough to cook w/, so it's a waste), eggs, 100% cheese, 100% juice, peanut butter, wheat bread (not the white bread kids will actually eat their PBJs on), & $6 worth of *fresh* or frozen (apparently canned goods are evil) veggies.

It comes in *checks* that spell out exactly what can be purchased (all at once, use it or lose it) on ea one (ea has different stuff) & is a PITA for cashiers & the ppl behind WIC moms in line b/c they have to go over ea & every item & check the specified weight etc & tick it off. Seems most cashiers have to call for a front end mgr to do it for them b/c the cash register can't.

In order to get WIC, both mom (but not dad) & kid(s) involved have to present themselves monthly for weighing, measuring, *health checks* (which are really *can we call CPS on them for any reason* checks), nutrition lectures, cooking lectures & activites w/ recipes, o, & to actually get the checks handed to Mom & sign off on that....what a PITA. It used to be you just went in once & they mailed you the *checks*. Now they assume anyone who applies is stupid & incapable of cooking & child care. Paper pushing.

What is wrong with not having sex before marriage? I know many many people that have done that.

Your anecdotal experience does not reflect the real world.

I love gardens also, but they're not exactly free. This family lives in Las Vegas, not really a garden friendly environment, it takes a lot of expensive water to keep one going there, and even then many plants can't take the 115 degree summer heat. Not to mention the soil is dreadful and must be dealt with somehow. I also live in the desert, and my garden ends up costing me quite a bit. The food is worth it, of course.

JG - you can grow 100 lbs of potatoes in an area 4 feet by 4 feet. You do it by using a frame where you keep adding dirt as the potato plants grow and get several inches above the dirt. You wind up with a frame that goes 4 feet up. I may not be describing it very well, but if you google it, you can probably find a better description and instructions on how to add slats to the frame as the potato vines grow upwards.

Vcllist - I live where it gets hot also. Right now, I am not on a water meter, but will be within a few years. So I am now learning and practicing ways to conserve water and grow organically and using mulch to keep the water from evaporating as quickly. It's all in how the garden is set up. And it can be quite expensive at first if you purchase drip irrigation. I have not yet--I'm hoping to do that this summer. There is also something called permaculture--google it if you are interested in it. It shows a lot of promise in conserving water as well.

assuming that the land is not heavily polluted as a lot of inner city lots are...

Living in an inner city is never good. So the first thing anyone hoping to live well must do is get out of the inner city. There are abandoned farmsteads all across America, small towns with abandoned buildings and declining population, places just begging to be lived in again. Healthy places. Places with relatively clean air and water, good soil, where families can be raised away from the crime and perversions of the urban Babylons.

It was a foreclosure sale. There are some deals out there if you look for them, but it takes quite a bit of research and looking, and a little luck.

We just bought a house, a brick one which we always wanted, in a very nice wooded area with lots of land, cheap. If you are looking, don't write off the nicer neighborhoods - some upper-middle- and upper-class folks have really gone upside-down on their finances and need liquidity, opening up some good housing opportunities for the more solid, working class home buyer.

Land. It's still the best investment. I am going to have a huge garden, and use the metal clothes rack instead of the dryer, too!

While I applaud their frugality, I have to agree with Mia. They used their savings to pay off their car loans and buy a house outright for 30k. That means even on 14k/year, they don't have the two biggest expenses most people face: car payments and mortgage/rent payments.

Admirable that they've managed their money so well but not that impressive given the specifics.

@Do you know

It is impressive. Very few people can do what they have done. And have stuck with their game plan.

I still buy clothes at the good will store, it's a cheaper than any dept store, and the clothes are in good shape. Yes, they are used clothes, but guess what, I don't care, as I am saving money.

I also use grocery coupons, plus whenever a real good sale comes on, my sister and two brothers and I buy in bulk and divide it between us. More money saved. My vehicle I bought from a car leasing company, at a very good discount. It was two and a half years old when I purchased it, and paid cash for it.

Like them, I use a credit card for emergency only. I pay cash or use a debit card, which is the same thing IMO, as it comes right out of checking then and there.

I also work two jobs, the second job is a free lance job and that income is all invested in the markets in tax free bonds, and in quality stocks with good dividends.

The only reason I haven't paid my house off is I need a tax write off, and the house provides me with a decent one. Now all this is easy for me as I'm not married, nor do I have any children. But I can realize the struggles people like them go through.

So yes, IT'S VERY IMPRESSIVE in my opinion.

They actually don't have three big expenses. Mortgage, Car payment, and HEALTH INSURANCE. I pay 14K a year on health insurance alone.

That's true, but I think it also points out how payments on homes and vehicles with interest can kill ya with a thousand cuts.

This is just one family. There is a variety of resources out there for tips on how to live more frugally. My favorite has always been the book Cheaper and Better by Nancy Birnes. There are some pretty hilarious YouTube videos on tiny houses (some with trailor hookups) built for a few thousand dollars. Obviously few people are going to do that, but they're fun.

When I was done with them, I traded in my good quality DVDs, books, and CDs to Amazon for a credit that I then used to purchase necessities. Amazon sells everything now. It's not Little House on the Prairie, but it helped out.

How can this article not mention MEDICAL INSURANCE?! How much do they pay for that?

We also live very frugally, but out of a gross income of $38 for a family of 4, we pay $6,500 of that for medical insurance and then another $2,000 for actual medical care (copays, etc). That leaves us $31K and change to actually live in one of the most expensive states in the US (NY metro area). We do it, and everybody is fine, but it's ridiculous for this little profile not to mention what is probably a family's biggest expense--often bigger than housing. You can choose to live in a small apartment and eat beans, but there's not much choice in cost of medical care.

There should be a K after the $38--$38K.

Medical insurance is a huge scam. I'm 65 years old. I haven't paid a dime for medical insurance my entire life. I've been to see a doctor 3 times in the last 20 years. I paid cash each time. I wouldn't have spent that money if the damn government would let me buy antibiotics over the counter.

That means even on 14k/year, they don't have the two biggest expenses most people face: car payments and mortgage/rent payments.

Most (98-99%) family's don't live on 14K a year for an income. and You cant afford a car for long on 14K a year paid off or not. so for low income earners the car is not a factor. I know you can rent for 200 a month. Even if it is not the safest area. how ever many that are living with that low of an income are in section 8 housing.

I know you can rent for 200 a month. Even if it is not the safest area.

Where? It's not the 70s anymore.

how ever many that are living with that low of an income are in section 8 housing.

No, they're not. Plenty of retirees own their own home & have burned their mortgage yrs ago. And the avg time sitting on a wait list for Section 8 is 3-5 yrs. It's not like you just walk into the local DSS & they hand you an apt.

It's also not like Section 8 is a *freebie*, either. Ppl are paying a *rent portion* equal to 40% of income nowadays (it used to be 25%). So if you're disabled & getting $800/mo SSD, you're paying a bit over $300 in rent on Section 8. You can't find an apt for less than $300. Most are at least $500 & that's a very sm cheap studio or 1BR.

A married cpl w/ 2 opposite sex kids of schl age would be required to have a 3BR by Section 8, & those are hard to find & would probably be in the range of $900/mo. There just aren't that many 2, 3, or 4 BR apts, period, let alone ones that will accept Section 8, permit inspectors in annually, & do the work to keep the apt's Section 8 status. Your LL won't fix a broken window, you just lost your *discount* & are now faced w/ hurrying up to find a new place that takes Section 8 (they only give you 60 days to do it or you lose it), or paying the full $600/mo rent or whatever.

Where? It's not the 70s anymore.

2006 as I said they are not the safest area's

lol! you got that right....I keep saying the govt. should publish the budget and make a reality show called $Saving America$....and let we the people do the cuts! it could work!

You forget that one considers wasteful Govt. spending, another sees as a lifesaver when times are tough or loved one/breadwinner is ill or deployed. Don't make our Government a reality show

Margaret Thatcher used the analogy of the budgeting housewife when she ran the UK and was derided by parliament, however in her term of office (12 years) the country had a positive balance of trade (i.e the world owed the UK more than it owed the world for goods) & the country was debt free (the only time in the history of the UK before or since.)

Just sayin'

Jimangie, is that all you've got in response to our Governments racking up offensive levels of debt - that some people need handouts to survive??

That's it?

It's SEVENTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS!

mickymac,

'SEVENTEEN TRILLION DOLLARS' is your rounded-up figure of the current national debt, and it ISN'T the amount of the government's deficit. That amount is much less than one trillion and falling, under the Obama Administration.

(Just sayin').

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_deficit_chart.html

http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/02/03/10312358-did-obama-make-the-economy-worse-not-according-to-most-statistics

Ok rradiko. Two things;

1. I specifically mentioned debt, not deficit, so your comeback makes no sense.

2. The trillion dollar deficit you so proudly tout, is for ONE YEAR. Our government is spending one trillion dollars MORE than it brings in in one year.

And this to you is some sort of positive??

Madness and incompetence are taking over this country.

@Julia

I paid 33K for mine, a 4 1/2 bedroom (the 1/2 is my office space), two and a half baths, it's 1,950 sq feet ranch style, and a nice front patio and a complete covered back patio, with a 2 1/2 car garage. I got mine the same way, a foreclosure sale. I put 20% down, and financed the rest.

Thanks to my father and two brothers, they did the fixing up on what needed to be done inside and out. I did all the interior painting, plus all the masking of windows outside while my oldest brother taught me how to use a paint sprayer. (that was fun & funny). But next time the house needs painting, I will rent a sprayer and do it myself. I did, after I was done painting inside, have a carpet company install the new carpets. That was one of the biggest expense's of fixing it up.

Buying food, like you say, is expensive. Have you ever checked into buying bulk? Things like rice, flour (if you do a lot of baking) beans, can be purchased by the bulk real cheap. We have here what is called a Winco store, where a lot of things are in bulk, pasta of all sorts, gravy mixes, cheese mixes, peas, candy of sorts, even some dried veggies. The Albertson store here also has at times, double or even triple coupons for the amount off.

Every penny does count. But yes, food is also my biggest expense, and as being single, I don't feel that I eat that much as for what the cost is. I can understand how huge an expense that would be for a family of four or more.

Now trying to find a house for that price is non-existance. This was shortly after everything went to hades, and all the foreclosed homes were really cheap. The same home I bought is now selling for around 124K or more. I got lucky, I guess. But glad I did.

Yup, you can find those prices in some states...but not in the Northeast.

I've heard Detroit has houses that are less than $30K, but I wouldn't want to live there.

My whole goal in choosing my current location is excellent education for my children. I would not want to homeschool them for long periods of time because I don't feel I can match what a first-rate school can offer them--lab facilities, excellent sports facilities, technology, different points of view, interaction with other kids, etc. Living in an area with top schools is more expensive, but I hope it pays off eventually. Then I'll move to a cheaper area.

A person needs to live where there's work, too. One reason the house may have been so cheap is because there's little to no work available in the area. That's fine if one works from home, or in this case doesn't work because they're going to school. But for most people that's a difficult consideration.

Additionally, what do they do if their car breaks down? Just one $1000 repair bill can blow that budget out of the water.

I was on-board with this family's plan until it came to the "home-schooling" part. An actual school has benefits (and detriments) beyond education. It provides children with other cultural references, their own social network (friends they pick), increased social awareness...

Since mom is 28, there are two inferences I made-a) her children are still in their early primary school years, and b) mom has a high-school education at most. Her ability to adequately educate her children is going to diminish over the years. For all the very ardent proponents of home-schooling, I'll point out that according to an LA Times article which was quoting an army recruiter, the majority of potential recruits who didn't pass the army's IQ requiremnt were home-schooled.

Five finger discount food.

food is very cheap if you buy smartly have have a set meal plan. For example we buy a 5 lb pork roast and that is one meal (is $16) potato's is $2 and a can of pees 64 cents. then we use one lb of the left overs to make tacos. then we use what is left to make pulled pork or we make spaghetti and use the left over sauce and pork to make chilly the day after.

They only gloss over food expenditures in this article...who's to say they don't get Food Stamps? I know of families of 4 who receive over $500 per month in Food Stamps, and they make more than $14,000 per year. This family has the potential to receive over $700 per month for food, which would make it alot more feasible to live on that much, again by being subsidised by taxpayers. Seems there are alot of holes in this story...

again by being subsidised by taxpayers.

Are you against that? Are you one of the people that would go to an orphanage and kill every child because they are on Government assistance? I bet you would because that is all the GOP want they are a bunch of Baby killers and wife beaters go back to beating you child for the next 8 hours and let the real men talk.

Have you ever checked into buying bulk?

Have you ever seen the kitchens in an avg apt?

Not gonna work when there's nowhere to store things.

I never thought to check b4 I moved into mine. My cupboards are only 12 in deep! Usually they're 15 in deep. That loss of 3 in makes a lot of difference in storage potential. I can barely fit in plates (no, I can't even get a rack & stand them up, b/c the shelving isn't high enough). I had to get a rack for baking pans & juuust made it in a narrow bottom cabinet for my biggest cookie sheet. Every time I open the door my air-bake pizza pans whacks me in the ankles b/c none of the cupboards will fit it. They won't even hold a box of cereal, even on its side, w/o propping open the door from hanging off the shelf. No pantry, so I can't even stack canned goods due to the low shelving. Drives me nuts.

It's really hard to stock up on good sales or buy in bulk when you haven't got any space to put it. I don't want pasta in w/ my underwear TYVM.

Since mom is 28, there are two inferences I made-a) her children are still in their early primary school years, and b) mom has a high-school education at most. Her ability to adequately educate her children is going to diminish over the years.

If it hasn't gone south already. Ppl think it's so EZ to teach. It isn't. And the primary yrs are the hardest, believe it or not. W/o a solid foundation, kids will flounder in HS. And I'm so sure Mom has the knowledge base to teach every single subject adequately even at the ptrimary level, let alone MS & HS levels. Homeschooling should not be permitted at all unless the parent doing so is a certified teacher.

@Scott

I would expect nothing less of a comment from one of the LAPDOGS of the low informed GOP base. Funny it all came crashing down on a GOP President, who's party had complete control for 6 of his 8 yrs in office.

Want to try again little doggie? ARF arf.

No, Scott, it's the Republicans who don't want companies to have to pay a living wage and who ship jobs overseas for slave labor in order to show a bigger profit this year and get a million dollar bonus for themselves and scroo everyone else who have ruined this country.

Sorry SallyAnn

Good point Willie

I just look at the 80's decade as one of the better decades of my life.

Ronald Reagan was president and life just seemed good!

I'm tired of watching jobs go overseas! When everyone has a job a lot of our

problems go away.

Jobs go overseas because those companies are not non-profits. The politicians don't send jobs overseas, the stock holders do, by demanding a decent return on their investment. American consumers send jobs overseas by demanding more bang for their hard earned buck.

Yup the whole article is the perfect version of the Republican American Dream. For everyone else.

I look back at the 80's as a great part of my life because of the music and where I was living. Reagan was a traitor to the Americans Iran held hostage. He was also involved in illegal arms trading, deficit spending, and opened the door for the likes of Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld and the rest of the GOP Nazis to take over America. No other president had as many people from their administration end up in jail as Reagan did.

Family's have done this many years to go though college at a latter age. so there is nothing new about it unless you consider any thing as old as 50 years new.

@Gus, I'm sure that they do. Ever been to Las Vegas in the summer? Want to try again with that statement?

I admire people like that who take the personal responsibility, and stand on their own two feet and can make it. Now, this is not a political statement, contary to what people make think: Is there any reasons why other people can't do this, or is this a whole different scene? I'm thinking more people could if they tried, but they probably are the late 40 and 50's age who see no prospect of ever having a decent paying job again, thus they stay on food stamps and unemployment.

I do feel if that family of four can do it, and living in Vegas isn't all that cheap, other smaller families can do it also. The question is: WHY AREN'T THEY? Or are they and we never hear about it?

Guss - I live in Bakersfield, CA and have a high end swamp cooler. I quit using my AC over 8 years ago the first time I got a $400 PG&E bill (for one months electric!). I could not afford that kind of bill then, and I certainly can't now. We use the cooler and fans, and use half of what we would use. In fact, people typically get $800 a month PG&E bills to cool a house my size. I rarely get over $250 a month during the summer. Once my son gets enough money saved to buy a car with cash and get his own place, he will move back out and my bill will be even smaller--he has a little one room AC unit in the back room he rents from us because the swamp cooler does not reach back there.

If they can run the A/C then they can buy a doggone clothes dryer so the woman doesn't have to hang the clothes on a line in the hot sun. It makes no sense to me. Have the man hang the clothes for a few weeks and a dryer will magically appear.

Its funny, I could easily afford a clothes dryer, but I like sun dried bedding and clothing. I like even more that it is free. When I was growing up, virtually no one had air conditioning. The movie theater in the county seat had it, but I can't think of any other place. I finally bought one a few years ago, but I rarely use it. Only on those nights when it is too stifling hot to sleep. That's maybe 4 or 5 days a year. Even then the noise tends to keep me awake. I'd rather make up a doss out on the porch. There's almost always a breeze on this hill where I live. Living in artificial conditions seems unhealthy to me. I know my grandmother refused to go into places with air conditioning. She said the cold shock would make you sick. Our parents lived without air conditioning and electric clothes dryers. Surely we can too.

It's obvious that no one in the family has allergies, wherein hanging sheets outside to collect pollen and mold spores would created more medical bills. Also, the neighborhood they live in must not have any CCRs against outside clothes lines. And they're in Vegas. Call us back when there's rainy and snowy weeks down there.

As for homemade laundry detergent, it's a good thing that the kids are home schooled. There are few things worse than having body odor when you're a kid in school. Home made soup and detergents were common in the 1970s, and you could smell who was using them.

When I was in school in Phoenix AZ in 2003 I put my AC at 80 degrees in the summer and my highest power bill was $48.

I admire people like that who take the personal responsibility, and stand on their own two feet and can make it.

I just had to laugh at that statement.

How are they *standing on their own 2 feet* & *taking personal responsibility* when they get their entire income from the US gov't?

Mom should put her kids on the schl bus, quit blogging, buy a dryer, & get a damn job.

I would bet that woman has never worked a day in her life if she's 28, already has schl-aged kids, & lived off her hubby's military paychecks. All the time in the world to homeschool, blog, & be *frugal* on gov't $.

Not impressed. (Not impressed w/ that awful skirt that probably cost $50, either.)

Because, there are many lazy people in the world! And, unless they are pushed, they will continue to use the system we pay for. This family shows what people can do, when they NEED to do so and have no choice.

Yeah, why don't the people on welfare just buy a house on cash instead of rent! Oh, wait, it's because they don't have the money to begin with, isn't it. Hmm.

Education. Without experiencing good parenting or good schooling, people very rarely acquire the skills and discipline necessary to get it together.

Circumstances (timing and location) have a lot to do with it. I graduated from college in the early eighties in a small town in a Rocky Mountain state. My school loan debt upon graduation was $1200. I was entirely self-supporting throughout college, working part-time as a nurse's aide, and living in a tiny house (shack, really) close to campus. I never suggested that my kids would be able to pull that off in this millenium in SoCal, because I know it can't be done here and now.

Location does play a part. If you are in a bad location, move. This is a huge mostly empty country. Get away from the coasts and you'll find plenty of room to live well.

Yeah, move. Get away from your aging parents, your nephew who needs a role model, and your network.

Why can't the 60 million strong welfare crowd do this?

B/c the US gov't doesn't hand them a $14K/yr stipend to go to college?

Education. Without experiencing good parenting or good schooling, people very rarely acquire the skills and discipline necessary to get it together.

They're not allowed to go to college at all. It's no longer called *welfare*. It's called *workfare* & they work for their pittance in benefits until they can find a *real* job that pays min wage.

The avg amt of time a family spends on cash assistance is 12-18 mos & they get less than half of what this family gets from the gov't w/o the luxury of going to college so that they can be successful in life & using homeschooling & blogging as an excuse not to get a job.

Why isn't Mom working instead of playing on the computer? Put those kids on the schl bus! HS education if that & she *thinks* she's qualified as a teacher. She isn't & her kids will suffer for her hubris later on.

If you are in a bad location, move.

Yes, b/c everyone has the resources to do that./s

Why do you keep saying that scar_tissue? How do you know she only has a high school education? She's 28, by age 28 I already had a BA in business and my AA in Accounting. It is possible to go to school and raise children.

@Lisa

Very good point about the health insurance. Yes, they have done a wonderful job of thinking outside the box. I have the space for a garden, but don't have a garden as I don't have time right now to grow anything and take care of it while it's growing. That is the bane of having two jobs, but then again, I don't have the expense of a family either.

@taxes

You asked why the 60 million welfare crowd isn't doing this. My reply to that little pouch of a lap dog is simple. Go live in NYC, where you don't find any houses, let alone rent that cheap.

Or if the rent is cheap, you have plenty of company also living there. Maybe you want people to live with rats, mice, cockroaches, etc, but I don't. And why, as a good Christian GOP er wishing that to happen to people, living with vermin?

And not all of those 60 million were in the military while she was saving and doing the home schooling, etc. Any more stupid comments from the little doggie section? arf arf poochie.

If the corporate news is trying to convince people to accept a lower standard of living (and maybe they are!) then lets give them what they want, but not how they want it! If each of us Americans cut way down on buying junk from China and other 'slave labor' markets, and bought USA-made first, fair trade international second, and then Chinese-made only if absolutely necessary (like a car part since most of us need a vehicle to get to work, if that car part isn't made anywhere else). And we need to support our local businesses when ever possible. I'm not saying 'don't be frugal about it' but what I am saying is that with the money you decide in your budget can be spent on certain things, spend that money where it will do 'double duty' by meeting your need and at the same time, supporting the kind of businesses you want to see prosper. None of us can do this 100% because so much stuff is made overseas now. But if we can make a significant dent in it, these outsoursing big corporations will get the message--in their pocketbooks. It is this way, I believe, that we can take back our country. And can you imagine the screaming the credit card companies would make if even half, or a quarter of people owing them, paid off their balances as quickly as possible and then only used the credit cards for emergencies??

Yes, give them what they want, but not how they want it. They have already cooked our goose--let them realize that we won't be laying any more golden eggs for them. We're going out and getting our own gosling--it's little now, definitely not laying any golden eggs right now --it has to grow up and mature first. Then the golden eggs will belong to us!

you make great sense. I buy almost ONLY american, don't do walmart, buy from small shops and farmers locally etc etc. Love it this way.

Absolutely, Lisa! It's how we operate, too. The less you buy, the less they earn! No smart phone, no TV or cable, no vacations, make it yourself, etc.

The one thing that we don't do is pay cash. I keep us on a very tight budget and we don't buy what we can't pay for, but I pay for everything with my credit card, which earns me cash back. I've never quite understood why frugal people stick to cash; if one has the self-discipline to stick to a budget and if you don't pay interest or membership fees, then credit cards are a great money-management tool. You just have to pay in full and on time.

For the "buy American" crowd- good sentiment, but what in the heck do you do for clothes, other than make your own or wear Pendleton? Or cars? Even "American" brand autos use foreign parts or are partially/completely assembled in other countries.

calif nurse--sometimes, we do have to buy something like a car part where we don't really have a choice. We can't always buy USA made, or fair trade international. But if we do when we can, it is a step in the right direction. This is not a change that will come overnight, but we need to start where we can. I would rather buy a few more expensive new clothes items per year from USA or fair trade sources with my clothes budget than a bunch more slave labor cheap clothes items. I can mend and make do with what I have and still buy a new item, just not as often. Or I can buy gently used clothes at a yard sale or second hand store. It doesn't matter where those come from, since they are already here and will support local economy through the secondhand store or my neighbors yard sale.

Lee-1515484---I think the frugal people who stick to cash do that to help themselves actually stick to a budget. Otherwise, it's easy to loose track, and overspend without meaning to. A person has to find what works for them. My mom in law uses her credit card but pays the balance off every month. That *IS* a good way to earn cash back, and at the same time, the credit card company is not making a ton of money off of you. (from what I understand, credit card companies do NOT like responsible and thrifty people like that --they don't make a ton of money off of them--but that's the companies' problem, not the responsible and thrifty consumer!) It would also be easier not to inadvertently overspend by keeping track of a credit card like you do a check book with a maximum $ allowed per month.. A person could even make themselves a little card book with a place to put a homemade paper ledger--kind of like a check book but smaller. If a person has a really secure safe, they could put the amount of money in the safe that they would spend and use the credit card instead, then they would have the $ to pay the bill at the end of the month, and still earn cash back. But if the credit card is just too much of a temptation, then the best thing to do is use cash.

Hey Bob. Let me get this straight. This guy goes to fight in Iraq, to protect your lazy ass freedoms, and you have the audacity to say WE paid for his house and cars!

As far as the racial angle that you throw in from know where - WTF!!

Wipe the chips off man, and just be thankful there are people out there willing to protect your sorry ass for peanuts.

Let me add that any civil servant is being paid with taxpayer monies. Maybe you'd be happier if this family lived out in the woods and picked berries and shot rabbits. Your reasoning belongs with 10-day-old garbage.

Exactly, mickymac! Those fighting for us have more than paid for their 'benefits' - all of them - whatever they may be. A war veteran should never have to worry about the basic necessities of life. We all owe them at the very least that much.

Bob--when my tax dollars get spent helping people, I like stories like this--and I don't care what color the subjects of the stories are! When my tax dollars are spent helping people get a leg up, that's good! Did you know that there are a lot of people of all colors that get help through various programs that actually WORK - they work at minimum wage jobs, and are NOT sitting in front of the TV all day. And the man in this story, like mickymac says, was dodging bullets for YOUR freedom. The rest of us owe this man and all of his fellow soldiers--and there is a high percentage of minorities in the armed forces--a huge debt of gratitude. Whether you agree with the politics behind Irac, Afganistan, etc. is not the issue here. Our soldiers ARE the issue--and I say help every single one of them and their families, or don't send them in harms way to begin with.

When it comes to any form of welfare, as long as it is tied to meaningful work (that includes schooling, training in preparation) then it is a foot up, not a hand out.

Jan makes a good point. We all need firemen, police, garbage collectors, etc. Try to get by without them and see what happens.

Bob, I will say this--your last question--yes, and I would like to see their stories as well. I do hope that Scott Stump will read this and give us some more stories--a good cross section, because that would be encouraging to all of us.

Well said, MickyMac. Agreed.

Sorry Mickymac, but no one went to Iraq to fight for my freedom, or yours. They went there to steal a country's natural resource. Same goes for Afghanistan. Look up "Taliban in Texas" to find the truth about that war.

Ah, you misunderstand me. I have no chips, I'm a navy vet myself. You paid for my college education (ROTC scholarship), my housing and food (mainly lived on the ship when I was single), my new Honda Prelude (paid for with $$ saved while on deployment), my health care, etc.

And yes, when the new missile we were test firing broke apart and hang-fired on the rail, blowing out the booster on deck right above my head, and when the turbine generator condenser blew up and I had to run down INTO the engine room to prevent further damage, and when the idiot admiral kept us on station for a bogus exercise in the middle of a hurricane and the air search radar came within a pubic hair of snapping off the mast, I was putting my life on the line. I "earned" the $$ and benefits.

But I admit I am where I am today because of the government programs and benefits that were available to me. And so is this family, but the article makes it out to be that they did it all by themselves. No, they didn't.

And I simply make the case that this story and all the extreme couponing shows and articles mainly feature white people, whereas low income black people have been doing these kinds of things and more for decades.

It's very much like the media stories on Hurricane Katrina: blacks that were taking food and supplies to save themselves were described by the AP News Service as "looting a grocery store" whereas a white couple doing so "found bread and soda in a local grocery store".

Bob if what you say is true, then you of all people should know that you earned every penny and then some. So the only reason I can come up with for your antagonism to the people in this article is that they are white, and you have decided to see some hidden racial bias to this story. You do realize you are reading MSNBC, right? Not exactly the literary arm of the KKK.

Come on man. Stop seeing things that are not there.

Not sure what "freedoms" some of these posters are talking about. Last time I checked, our civil liberties were being slowly stripped away

good for you !! Say it like it is . This story has made me so avagrated at MSN and Today . If they only give fair play to average white people, and only tell a little part of the truth then how can you belive anything they are saying? Poverty is something important to me personally and to lie or tell half truths about it is a shame. I would really like to see the bank records of these frugal people . Prove to me that all you get is 14K for everything you need to live on . Go ahead prove it yourself not thru MSN or Today. Do you or do you not recieve income from your blog or web site? Do you or do you not get food stamps or any equilivent to that???? How do you pay your health and dental care bills? Is your husband also a carpenter , electrician and plumber so he can fix all the problems that come with home ownership. Why is your husband not working now?? Is he a blissful student looking for the job he dreams of which is a policeman or will he take what he can get ??? How is your health BTW I am sure there must be some high blood pressure there somewhere supporting all that weight. You can blame MSN and Today for a lot of America being unbelievers and perhaps a little angry at you folks for stating this stuf the way it has been stated. Don't blame the responders blame the storytellers

When it comes to any form of welfare, as long as it is tied to meaningful work (that includes schooling, training in preparation) then it is a foot up, not a hand out.

Then why was that eliminated in the Welfare Reform Act?

They're not allowed to get an education anymore. It's either take the 1st crappy job that comes down the pike, or work for a pittance in cash assistance while you job hunt.

DSS makes them attend 45 days of *I'm too stupid to get a job* class b4 any cash assistance is even issued, & then another 45 days to use these *skills* to get a job.

After that initial 6 wks on cash assistance, if they don't find a job, then they work wherever DSS places them for the cash assistance.

There is no *hand up* involved in it. It is reduced to *get the hell off*.

But I admit I am where I am today because of the government programs and benefits that were available to me. And so is this family, but the article makes it out to be that they did it all by themselves. No, they didn't.

Agreed.

And I still think Mom should put those kids on the schl bus, quit farting around w/ being a *blogger* (supported by click-thrus that give them additional income not incl in the $14K), & get a REAL job. She's not a teacher & she's not a writer. She's lazy & expects hubby to bring home the bacon so she can sit on her ass & be *trendy*..

@Arizona Wille

Maybe it WOULD ADD UP if you knew how to understand what was written. Please go back and re-read the beginning of the statement. Or do you need some one to explain the simple things to you?

Do they still go to the commissary? Subsidized by the government.

It is cheaper not to shop there.

Do they get food stamsp? Another government subsidy

Almost all family's of 4 live on food stamps.

He was in the service and she couldn't pay the bills, but yet she managed to save over 30K in order to pay cash for the house?

We are saving 2-4K a month to buy a house. However My wife is an E-7 and I'm an auto technician.

she didn't save that 30k in one year I'll assume.

we have to remember they live on 14K a year NOW, before while he was still on active duty he was making more, plus he was deployed, during a deployment they make combat pay and no fed taxes other than ss and mc, that can be an additional 1200.00 a month. Preparing for him to get out of the military and knowing they were going to have to live on much less, she probably only used his normal pay and set aside everything extra. I did the same thing, and saved quite a bit of money in a year.

@randomB

Actually it doesn't take that long to make soap. Biggest or cost in time is shredding the bar soap.

Reason I know that is my cousin makes her own soap. And it is cheaper, way cheaper than buying powder of liquid soap at the stores.

But yes, this exactly maybe the way we all end up living. Even the lap dogs of the low informed base of the GOP. But they still cling to the theory that the 2% will elevate them up to that level of income.

And how dumb is that. Listen to their whinning and barking when they realize they are part of the serf crowd like the rest of us will be. But right now, they can't see that far in the future.

Sally, ure intelligent, and funny too! (arf, arf)

I do buy in bulk when I can, my friends and I split it up and share the cost. East very simply too, just trying to stay healthy with it too. Here's a go to recipe of mine: ANY vegetables (celery onions carrots garlic) chopped up and sauteed in a bit of oil, add stock, 2 or 3 cut up potatoes, and then more veggies....spinach, escarole, broccoli, whatever, season with herbs you enjoy. Then pour into a blender or use a hand immersion blender, and you've got a hot thick soup with lots of veggies, and the potatoes thicken it so no need for flour and fat. You can add a bit of milk and some cheese to if you'd like for that flavor ..... I've also added bits of chicken leftovers too.

If you get some dayold veggies, it's cheaper, and they are great for soup.

RandomB --- NEITHER one has a JOB.

The husband is going to school on the GI Bill and gets $14,000 a year for living expenses and she is a stay at home Mom.

It's a mystery to me how, when he was in the service, she couldn't pay the bills but yet she managed to save over $30K in order to pay cash for the house they bought. Saved 30K while not able to pay the bills? Hmmm that don't add up. Unless she didn't pay the bills on purpose.

The article doesn't mention whether they get food stamps, but they probably do, they certainly would be eligible for them.

Whoever wrote this article should be fired. Very poor journalism.

Unless they are trying to prove that people don't need the minimum wage raised -- they can live on next to nothing.

Republicans ALWAYS predict dire consequences whenever the minimum wage is raised. And, indeed they are correct. There are dire consequences to THEIR PROFITS. They make a little bit less profit and that is the end of the earth to them.

It's one thing if you want to make soap as a hobby. But to make your own soap out of some sense of being frugal--well, it seems like a waste of time to me.

Depends on if you have the time to waste. If you have nothing more productive to do, you might as well boil down some animal fat with wood ash to produce some good old lye soap. We always kept a wash pot boiling when we were butchering hogs. Beats watching Jerry Springer.

It's a mystery to me how, when he was in the service, she couldn't pay the bills but yet she managed to save over $30K in order to pay cash for the house they bought. Saved 30K while not able to pay the bills? Hmmm that don't add up. Unless she didn't pay the bills on purpose.

fist of all it says they cut expensse When he was in the military. A lot of people in the military don't know how to handle money.

Proud but jaded: back when I was a kid, if a man came into work and told them he was having another baby -- the company gave him a raise.

Now they fire him because they don't want to pay the medical insurance.

and don't over-consume. Wal-mart crap is just that : CRAP. Not talking about food, but all the junk stuff I've seen in people's carts. Thrift stores are a great alternative to discretionary spending, and the ones I shop in benefit local charitable organizations, such as runaway teens, the local fire department, so it's win-win.

What part of he is currently getting a $14K/yr stipend for him to go to college from the US gov't did you not understand?

How is living off the US gov't not a *handout*? How is that *self-sufficient*?

Neither one of them has a job!

Damn straight they ought to be *frugal*! They are living off taxpayer $ & neither one of them is working! You can attend college & work PT. You can stop entertaining the notion that you are a real teacher & an online writer, & work FT to support your family. It seems they just don't want to work, esp Mom. She's waiting for Dad to graduate colleged & find a job.

"living off the government" is called a GI Bill scar_tissue, when you first join the military you pay into it. Kind of like social security.

Just stay away from the carbon tet--it is a highly dangerous chemical. This wasn't widely known back when it was used for dry cleaning.

Absolutely! I think the point of the story is not that everyone can make it on $14K (as lots of us have pointed out, that amount doesn't account for health insurance), but that everyone can probably look at their budget and see ways to improve, ways that money is being spent but not productively. And the fact that the family feels content is a great thing. A good attitude about money and living and what's important keeps a family strong throughout many hardships.

Not necessarily garbage Peter. There were a lot of bank-owned, bargain basement homes for sale in the Las Vegas area. The story also mentioned that her husband is handy around the house.

How "nice" for her husband to be ONLY a handy man... Just sad poor family, embarrassing to watch.

They live in a double-wide trailer in the desert. Just sayin'. It's a fine home, but it's in a hot climate (limited heat needed), plus it's not exactly an estate. And I totally agree about where you live. I live in the NE and rents are no cheaper than $1100 in my area for a one bedroom. Ridiculous. The rates went up when the housing market went bust.

Sounds like you live in the wrong place. Ryder is ready when you are. Relocate to a more sensible locale.