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Economic Policy Institute
The economy has been adding jobs lately, but not government jobs.
More than half a million, local, state and federal jobs have been cut since the recession ended in June 2009, according to an analysis released this week by the Economic Policy Institute.
That's the opposite of what happened following the previous three recessions and could be part of the reason why this recovery has been so weak, particularly when it comes to jobs. The government reported Friday that the unemployment rate fell slightly, to 8.2 percent in March, as the economy added 120,000 jobs, much fewer than had been expected.
Despite the government job cuts, more than 20 million people work in the public sector, making it a key part of the overall jobs picture.
In previous recessions, the public sector saw a percentage gain in jobs once the economy began to grow again, according to EPI’s analysis of government data. This time, there’s been a percentage loss.
Josh Bivens, the economist with EPI who compiled the data, said the biggest job losses this time have come from state and local governments. Those employers have had to deal with a drop in tax revenue, in part because of the housing bust, along with an increase in the need for social services and support programs such as unemployment insurance and Medicaid.
“States have two options when they’re faced with a looming budget gap: Raise taxes or cut spending, which means cutting jobs,” Bivens said. “It does seem like they’ve gone the spending cut route, judging from these numbers.”
The federal government also has cut jobs in certain sectors, such as the Postal Service, and faces the looming prospect of more cuts in areas such as defense. Overall, however, federal government employment is about the same as in mid-2009. The analysis excluded Census workers, who were hired temporarily by the government from late 2008 to late 2010.
There could be good news on the horizon for people want to get – or keep – a government job. In recent months, the pace of public-sector job losses has started to slow, and there has even been some net hiring in areas such as state and local education.
In the March unemployment report released Friday, there was a net gain in state government education jobs, but local education jobs recorded another drop from the previous month.
“The hope is that eventually this swings from negative to positive,” Bivens said. “I don’t expect it to continue to drag.”
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Not having so many government workers may have slowed down job growth but it was a positive for the economy not having to support more unproductive people.
I believe that less government workers = better economy about as much as I believe tax cuts always = a better economy. It is simply not true all you have to do is open your eyes and look around the last the 10 years.
Z, so if we have to support more government workers like Greece our economy would be better?
dear common man you are more in likely an uneducated individual, and i feel sorry for your family ! i hope you someday return to school and get your high school diploma ! until than maybe you and crisis could get together and read a little !
@schooldog...your poor grammar shows that you have little room to be calling someone uneducated. I think I learned the difference between "than" and "then" in grade school!
Back on topic...there are many problems with Greece. A contributing factor is the large number of government employees. The tax base cannot support the salaries and benefits of all the government employees and retirees while providing the government services.
Almost always...less government workers is better, specifically, when it applies to federal workers. When government becomes involved in commerce, it almost always contributes to the increase in cost. Examples are healthcare costs, pharmaceutical costs, college education costs, food costs, energy costs, security costs, prison costs and the list goes on.
Federal government was not designed to be the answer to solve problems that face the various states. The federal government was designed within a very limited framework outlined in the US Constitution. A government that is closer to the people that it governs, is always more responsive to the needs of the people. Any government cannot provide any service without taking from those they govern first.
Dear Dave most of us are able to use proof readers ! just as Albert Einstein or Steven Hawking's did or do at present ! Spelling is not even a major concern of many college educators and most graduates are able to have very successful careers ! and maybe the constitution is an outdated poorly written piece of paper !which some of us would perfer to replace !
What college do you teach at, I'm transferring for my masters!
@Schooldog...if you do not believe in the US Constitution, there is a process to follow to amend it.
I spent 23 years defending your right to speak and feel the way you do. But, I will uphold my oath to protect this country from all enemies, foreign and domestic...any attempt at circumventing the US Constitution makes you an enemy of this great country.
I am shocked to find out that you are a professor at a major university. I can tell you that grammar and spelling counted in all of my classes except math related subjects.
In your Utopia, does the government wipe your a$$ when you crap? Smaller government is far superior to a government that is too large to support by the general public. When government employees receive better benefits and pay than the public that supports it, the end is near. I suppose you think that Leon Panetta deserves to fly home every weekend to California at the taxpayers expense on a military private jet.
People need to stop and consider what services FEDERAL government employees actually provide to you. Police? sorry thats local, county and state. Fireman? wrong again! Trash collection? schools? Highway maintenance? ehhh 0 for 5! I remember when Newt and those mean republican congressman "shut down" the government during the Clinton administration. If it weren't for a hack press droning on endlessly about the parks being shuttered, hordes of illegal immigrants swarming across our borders, people being poisoned with rancid food and toxic water ...blah, blah, blah, no one would have noticed. I still chuckle remembering how the feds assured us that "essential" personnel would still be on the job, which begs the question, were the rest non-essential? Someone should ask the millions of illegal immigrants in this country! Obviously most are unneccessary. We just need a president and congress that will acknowledge it.
Timothy: Essential government workers are those that guard the nuclear sites, those that are negotiating treaties overseas, those that conduct law enforcement, and it goes on and on. The so-called not-essentials are those that recruit the brilliant engineer and scientists that work for the Federal governement, the pay specialists that ensure the guy negotiating treaties it being paid on time and without errors, the clerks who type out the treaties for signatures, the IT personnel who ensure communications are secure, and on and on and on.
It is called 'infrastructure", and you are an Idiot, Timothy.
Dear tim most if not all of the things you mention are subsided by the government and trained to government standards ! and subject to government laws ! so please think a little deeper !
Arrive-1: Please enlighten me on the accomplishments of those "essential" guardians of our nuclear sites, our federal overseas negotiators, our federal law enforcement conductors, as well as the "not essential" recruitors of federal "brilliant scientists", pay specialists, clerks, IT specialists negotiators, etc., etc.. You do realize that nuclear waste material generated by the individual generating facilities is being stored on site because the federal government will not accept it. They will not accept it after spending tens of billions of tax dollars excavating caverns in Nevada as a repository FOR ACCEPTING IT? Do you mean those essential negotiators telling the Iranians and Noth Koreans they better stop making nuclear weapons? Do you mean those Law enforcement ATF agents that supplied guns to Mexican narco terrorists in their "fast and furious" brilliance? You wanna praise the federal IT guys that can't seem to stop those chinese and russian hackers? You sound like an arrogant government worker who has suddenly begun to wonder why his job is relevant, or more precisely, how many tax payers believe its relevant. The government is a dinosaur when it comes to the "Infrastructure" cited in your final diatribe. Its filled, for the most part, with private sector rejects just counting the days until they can collect their fat pensions. Like you?
Schooldog - any federal subsidies recieved for the services I listed are a pittance. The strings attached to them hoeever are enormous. I sre most of us can do very well without either!
I'm flabbergasted!!! You want lower taxes, you want less government, you complain, all the time, that Federal workers are treated better, paid better than anyone else; and NOW, when the Feds have been dumping workers left and right, facing slashed budgets, the complaints are that the number of unemployed Federal workers are dragging the economy down.
Make up you minds - if you want Social Security, Welfare, Medicaid/Medicare, soldiers, space shuttles, trains, and everything else you expect the government to pay for, the MONEY has to come from somewhere. You can tax the 1% all you want - 80%, 90% of their net worth, and it STILL won't be enough to pay for all the programs you want the government to cover. Tax the low income, middle income and high income 35%, 40% and IT STILL WON'T COVER ALL THE PROGRAMS YOU WANT THE GOVERNMENT TO PROVIDE.
Something has to give - if you don't want a "big" government, if you object to Federal workers, then find private sector jobs for all those laid off federal workers. If you want all these programs, be prepared to open your wallet for more taxes. You can't have it both ways.
An economics professor at a local college made a statement that he had never failed a single student before, but had recently failed an entire class. That class had insisted that Obama's socialism worked and that no one would be poor and no one would be rich, a great equalizer.
The professor then said, "OK, we will have an experiment in this class on Obama's plan". All grades will be averaged and everyone will receive the same grade so no one will fail and no one will receive an A.... (substituting grades for dollars - something closer to home and more readily understood by all).
After the first test, the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. As the second test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too so they studied little.
The second test average was a D! No one was happy. When the 3rd test rolled around, the average was an F. As the tests proceeded, the scores never increased as bickering, blame and name-calling all resulted in hard feelings and no one would study for the benefit of anyone else.
To their great surprise, ALL FAILED and the professor told them that socialism would also ultimately fail because when the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great, but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed. It could not be any simpler than that. Remember, there IS a test coming up. The 2012 elections.
These are possibly the 5 best sentences you'll ever read and all applicable to this experiment:
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
by: Ed Will
dear boy : as a college professor at a major university for 26 years and i find your professors example typical of why education need's to put in the hands of open minded people who have no right wing agenda ! your professor should be release from service and a good faulty review could lead to this ! and this is why he teaches at a local college !
A college professor? Use the spell and grammar check in MS word before you try a boast like that
try to think and worry less about people's spelling mistakes ! the only people with perfect spelling are people who think slowly ! and usually lack creative thinking ! just a little educational fact !
It seems like a win win situation for the taxpayer. Don't have to support a union leech whether it gov.,state,city employee. We have enough leeches in wash.
Republicans are deliberately contributing to the high unemployment rate so that they have something to run on.
I don't know how you guys can think all this stuff up.
The lose of government jobs at the state and local level will continue for years to come. People do not have the salaries they used to have, and subsequently state and local tax coffers are shrinking. Either the unions are going to have to acquiesce and accept lower wages and benefits, or accept the continued decline in their numbers. Either way, the days of citizens being beholden to state and local unions are over.
Dear farer: please watch Wisconsin's recall election and think again about your statement !
Once governments get deep in debt it no longer matters who you elect into office. When you no longer have sufficient tax revenue or the ability to borrow the money needed to support big government, cuts will be forced on whomever is in charge.
'....drag on the economy.'
Which economy? There are two.... the thriving economy the Elite enjoy at the expense of the Citizens, and the other economy that the majority of Americans suffer under.
One Statesman could make the difference, and you people write him off...you would rather choose between a shark and a barracuda. I prefer that old fisherman... he knows what he's talking about.
Why is the US dollar now worth only 3.8 cents?
...and
Do people still believe what politicians say?
...and
When did the people approve the sale of their government?
The republicans scream bloody murder about the bloated size of the gov't. and then rant and rave about the unemployment rate when we fire those people and lean down the gov't payroll.
It apparently ain't about principle, just the desire to incessantly bitch about anything and everything!
One of the few bright spots in the unemployment data is the progressive drop in government jobs.
There is the problem with this story. The recession has never ended
most of the problems with the slowness of the recovery is caused by the republican party, corporate America and the oil industry who are afraid of the fact that government will be keeping a eye on them and there free ride is over ! it is time to change our form of government and look towards a more progressive form of government !
Hmm: I wonder if they consider the USPS "government".
I ask, for I've read that they will lose 100K jobs by switching to a 5 day week endorsed by Obama.
There supposed to close 3K small offices and a few hundred processing plants.
Then you have reductions in the military coming with withdrawals from Iraq & Afghanistan.
IRS functions are more automated.
I suspect Homeland Security & Border Patrol will stay at near todays levels or modestly higher.
Looks to me, that the jobs numbers (especially government) are destined get worse.
Anyone willing to bet against the idea, that these job changes won't take effect until AFTER NOVEMBER??/
As Dick Cheney said "deficits don't matter". The only reason Republicans in Congress are cutting government jobs is to tank the economy and push unemployment up, all in their efforts to get rid of Obama. This is the most self-serving bunch of egomaniacs ever elected ... and all of it based on lies. The said 2010 was all about jobs; just not that they were there to kill jobs.
Here's a thought....I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but doesn't seem awfully coincidental that you really can't comment on like 95% of the stories about unemployment or number of unemployed dropping and supposed job increases?
I say it's all BS. The only reason the unemployed percentage is really going down is because people are getting kicked off of unemployment, or they have exhausted their claim. It's not because a large amount of people are gaining employment. Not to mention their statistics don't account for that happening anyway. I also believe msnbc doesn't want to deal with the commenting about that stuff as well. Otherwise, you would be able to comment on all the stories they put online.
Gotta love it........the government and politicians say things are improving economically, but really from the poverty class and the "middle class" point of view.....things are just slowly getting worse.....
IF things would be getting better, there wouldn't be such an increase in home robberies, gas station robberies, and attempted bank robberies, ect....
Think I'm wrong? Check it out with your local news.....the crimes are going up very rapidly.....and you'll see with just a little research....I'm correct.
Whether or not you are eligible for unemployment is meaningless to whether or not you are counted in the unemployment figures. The unemployment rate is based on a survey of households, not unemployment offices.
The reason the unemployment rate is dropping, despite the weak labor market, is millions of people have dropped out of the labor force. The labor participation rate has dropped from approximately 65.5% at the official end of the recession to around 63.8% as of the end of March.
This translates to about two million less people who have currently jobs as compared to when the recession officially ended.
You do not mention the number of jobs gained in the private sector over the same period of time, why not? Government us already too large and is not self supporting. how many private sector workers does it take to support one government employee? how long can our country survive as long as the private sector workers support public sector workers, the disabled, Retired social security recipients, the unemployed, and illegal immigrants? What happens once we tip the balance and there are less people working to support the system than there are taking from the system? I can give you a historic example, the Roman empire (perhaps the greatest example of a failed entitlement system.
How many bottom feeders can the ocean support anyway.
Government workers feed off of the people; who, inevitable, must pay taxes, which is, in fact, the "G-mens" salaries.
Someone must eventually produce in order to pay. The problem has been too much surplus for the bottom feeders to feed off of. They just sit there, produce nothing, and get fat. Eventually the piper must be paid.
There must be a balance; and, as others have said before: “The least government is the best government”, which, I believe is true.
The question remains: How much government is enough government? Lets go ask the peoples of Greece. They might have something to say on this issue.
dear disill "And government workers don't pay income tax ? well yes they do ,which in turn contributes to economic growth and prosperity for all ! and also contribute greatly to society ! so i believe you are truly delusional and your analysis is in error !
@schooldog...ok. your post has established that you are not a professor of math. If a government worker makes $50k and pays taxes (let's say 20% for easy math). That means that the worker pays $10k in taxes. That leaves a net negative of $40k that has to come from other taxpayers. Let's not get into the benefits and retirement package.
If government workers are such a great solution, why isn't Greece flooded with cash?
They can call themselves non-partisan, but the Economic Policy Institute is simply another branch of the Democratic Party looking to spin the data in Obama's favor.
Comparing this economic "recovery" to those of the past is the fundamental reason everything appears skewed.
It is in NO way representative of the past, so how can it be used as a basis for comparison?
In the past, recessions were followed by REAL economic growth, not this TEPID, barely hanging-on crap. GDP at 2-3%? That's not growth- that's BARELY avoiding falling back into recession.
No growth, NO REVENUES.
Sure seems that the author of that article is suggesting we need to hire MORE gubmint employees that cannot be paid for...
Just like the failed near trillion-dollar stimulus, if you can't AFFORD IT, you can't HAVE IT. All the tax dollars given to the states to offset lack of tax revenues that would have forced layoffs of public employees...guess what...all a WASTE of money, temporarily delaying the inevitable.
Unlike the Federal gov't, state and local can't just fire up the printing presses when they want something they can't afford.
Last election the tea party republicans promised to create jobs and get the economy going again. What happened? No jobs from the teaparty...only obstruction...a war on women..and legislation to take away our right to vote. As a matter of fact the tea party republicans are destroying jobs of teachers, firefighters, police and many more public sector workers. Don't let me forget the gnop wants to start another unnecessary war and give billionaires the biggest tax cut ever. OBAMA-BIDEN 2012.
Please tell me you are not so ignorant as to believe that holding one House of Congress is enough to transform our economic situation. To the extent that the economy is gradually improving, thank Republicans in the House of Reps for putting a restraining order on the Obama agenda. Otherwise, things would be much worse.
You also might want to check out facts instead of posting propaganda. The lions share of the Bush-Era tax cuts went to the middle class and below. It was compromise legislation passed by a Senate split 50-50, supported by both parties.
IT is called look for them 3-4.5 million people are hired every month.
I say Give every one more taxes. we all don't pay enough taxes. Mitt payed 14.5 on 20 million for two yeas I paid 6.13 or less for 2 years on 91K.
Government jobs do not add anything productive to the economy. Over a certain number, they are a drag on the economy. There are nearly 22 million people working for government, about 17% of total nonfarm payrolls. That number needs to drop by at least 1/3, maybe closer to 40%. If that were to happen we would see a real recovery.