You are right. One needs to weight the cons and pros of having debt versus a degree. In a deflationary crash, being debt free is priority. Get a degree that you can afford with least debt. Do not borrow excessively.

This generation is perhaps the best-educated generation ever, but they can't find jobs. Many face staggering college loans and have moved back in with their parents. Even worse, their difficulty in getting careers launched could set them back financially for years.

Entire population is awash in debt! That is the problem. Current debt levels are still huge compared to GDP. History shows debt to GDP ratio will snap back to the mean. This makes a case for deflation to continue. Here is our excessive debt problem:

http://www.tradingstocks.net/html/inflation_deflation_credit_bub.html

Given that the bank credit that was inflated for 50 years is deflating now. This magnitude of a bubble does not deflate in a year, it will take some time.

The problem is that all of the prices we see around were based on borrowed money. Almost all of our money supply is bank credit. There is expectation that this will be paid back with interest. So if there is 60 trillion borrowed, then let's say we are supposed to pay back 100 trillion. Of course 100 trillion does not even exist yet, but with future borrowing it could. However, when borrowing stops, all of these expectations become impossible to realize. Here is how banks create money:

http://www.tradingstocks.net/html/banks_create_money.html

To make the long story short, when banks stop creating money, deflation starts. That shrinks the money supply. For example 60 trillion becomes 30 trillion. When there is half the amount of money in the economy, it is natural to expect that prices and salaries become half as well. Austrian School of Economics thinks this is unavoidable in a monetary system that is based on bank credit.

The economic cycles or business cycles such as Kondratieff Wave are created by the herding behaviour of the people. When Kondratiev Winter ends and spring starts, people look at each other and start expanding their businesses and investments just because others are doing so. Credit supply increases dramatically. Then expansion levels out and that is Kondratiev summer.This brings prosperity. Then the bill comes due and the debt must be paid off. Since everyone started at the same time, they all start paying off debt at the same time. This alignment of the entire population causes a major problem. In order to pay back debt, they reduce expenses, scale back new investments. Expansion stops, Contraction starts. When the debt is paid off, the money dissapears just the same way it was created by the banking system. This shrinks the money supply and Kondratiev Winter holds a strong grip on the economy. Once the debt level reaches reasonable levels, Winter ends and recovery, aka Spring starts again. Here is explanation of Kondratieff Wave:

http://www.kondratieffwavecycle.com/kondratieff-wave/

In this deflationary environment the best thing you can do is to avoid going into debt! Stay away from debt and save your dollars. They will be worth more at the bottom of the coming depression.

Unfortunately now Post Grad degrees are required in many fields. Occupational Therapy, Physical Therapy, Social Work, Addictions Counseling, in fact I am betting that Engineering also requires a MS as do so many other fields.

With these requirements college debt is going to continue to rise until we have a country full of unemployed worker bees who can't afford an education and a whole bunch of unemployed over educated because the worker bees can't afford the services and neither will the government be able to.

But we're almost there now aren't we?

It cant help that an entire industry was created to profit off our children's education.

Ask any parent of a 17 year old child. How many offers for student loans do you get on a daily basis? Low interest along with the promise of more money.

It seems to me that every facet of American life is designed for a person to profit from. I imagine that why we still use the internal combustion engine that burns gasoline. Not enough profit in alternative energy.

There is nothing wrong with profit. The issue is government sponsored cheap money. Just as cheap home loans inflated the housing bubble and put people in debt over their heads, cheap college loans have done exactly the same.

Get rid of the cheap money and the costs will recover, just as they are in the housing market. Cheap credit is the enemy.

Coach, while I would agree with you about the SKILLS people learn at college, they are also learned away from institutions of higher learning. I for one am more for experience. While I think that education is important, I would hire someone in their 30's with a solid work history than someone just out of college for a management position. I think experience is undervalued in todays job market. We are, in many ways, brainwashed by colleges to think the ONLY way to be successful is to go to college.

HOW to think (logic, deductive reasoning, etc) USED to be taught in public schools (in the days before NCLB). According to NPR less than 25% of new freshmen can't read / write cursive. You may think it is unnecessary until you have to actually deal with these kids.

Again from NPR roughly (if memory serves) 80% of new freshmen require remedial courses before they start credited classes. The tuition is the same. Freshmen are often required to take up to four remedial classes when they start even if they were straight A students.

It sickens me----Read "The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America" It can be found on line for free in a pdf format. VERY SCARY---and not a bit exaggerated.

lexiwords-1:

Hubby retired from one of the for-profit schools as President 3 yrs. ago. He told me that fully 1/3 of ALL entering freshman at State Colleges have to take remedial courses. He also told me the % of students who never graduate, but unfortunately, I forget that stat. & he's not here to ask. But it was somewhere @ 40-60%, I believe. Lots & lots of debt accumulating here.

Remember for many yrs. how the stats. used to circulate abut how much MORE an adult made if they had a 4-yr. Degree as opposed to no education after H.S.? Haven't seen that one in a while, have you? But, boy try to get a good plumber.

When States started making secondary schools take a test to graduate, I knew then for sure that things had been "Dumbed-Down." Apparently we can't TRUST grades alone.

NCLB is not the cause it is a remedy. By forcing schools to actually test their students, they can't just get away with faking a grade and passing on the uneducated students. That's why the teachers unions hate it, it exposes the total lack of performance the teaching community is guilty of.

Bush and Kennedy worked together on this specifically because this grade inflation crap was happening. If you really want your eyes opened, take a look at all the tricks and excuses school boards use to try to get around the testing. They really don't want you to know how bad they've been doing their job.

If you don't go to receive an EDUCATION there is no reason to go to college. No sympathy for you!

we have sympathy for you though..

we pay almost as much in taxes as our brethren in western europe and canada...yet we get none of the REAL benefits: 35 hour work days, free university, 5-8 weeks paid vacation, free healthcare, and a real retirement pension, not a "social secuirty: that we are now told was never meant to be counted on. No wonder our cities are crap and Americans look so stressed compared to our counterparts...we are bred to be slaves.

Don't listen to people who use insensitive language. The only reason that people dismiss your frustration is they understand that many young people are in an untenable position -- which generally means lots of debt, no marriage, no children, no homeownership, and no business ownership -- and they don't want to be accountable for it.

I have empathy for you. When you started school it looked like a very prosperous field. Unfortunately big corporate greed has leveled it. It would be lovely if we could all do something we'd like to do rather than what we have to. Hang in there. You'll find work. The unemployment rate for people with college degrees is about a quarter what it is for people without them.

I really hate that so many young people are in the same situation you have landed in. It floors me that there is so little education concerning debt prior to 18-22 year olds taking on way too much debt for just starting out in life.

We should be teaching our children how to get through college/university without saddling themselves with $20k+ in debt... but we're not.

What ever happened to the idea of taking a couple of years off after high school to live at home, work full time, & SAVE like MAD? And I hate to be the one to mention it, but there IS the G.I. Bill

What I WILL say as far as getting a good job is just 2 things:

1.) Health Care

2.) Electric/Electronic Engineering ( or any other high tech. field )

As of today, I know of no one in either of those fields who are unemployed. At least it gives you a fighting chance of actually GETTING a job & KEEPING one. And if you spend exhoribant amts. of $ to go to school, not to mention the hard work, you want a job after graduation.

BTW, health care can include medical coding, office manager, receptionist, etc. Not all is actual hands-on medical care. I was still being solicited for work as a nurse 10 yrs. after I retired, and can get a job today. (Couldn't do it physically tho., but the offer is there.)

Agreed, my wife is also a nurse and could get a job tomorrow if she wanted. I'm a retired electronics engineer and that has served me very well, allowing me to retire at 55.

All the hard sciences are a safe bet, as technology will be the only solution to many of the worlds problems.

On the other hand there is also guaranteed jobs for poly sci majors, we'll always need burger flippers. There are so many useless degrees out there it borders on fraud that colleges offer them with a straight face.

On life experience, I've found that on average the more educated one is, the less in touch with reality they are. Those with no degree, figure out the world real fast, those that are perpetual students may never figure out the real world.

With life long tenure, many professors get totally out of touch, the better ones have careers outside of academia. Colleges cannot teach life experience, at best they don't get in the way.

The problem is kids go into college being told they can study whatever they'd like and many kids choose poorly and don't plan ahead. Yeah cinema classes are fun, but do you think having a degree in Art is really going to get you a job?

Graduated last may with an Engineering degree, I was offered a job the following month.

Forgive me, but why would anyone take out 40K in loans to be a cop? That is very ill advised. He'll never be able to pay that back on a cops salary. You guys didn't do your homework on that one. Being a cop is a very noble profession but it's never paid all that well.

Bridget, you and your husband simply made a very bad choice. You said your husband was a first generation student, and implied he was a minority. I'm wondering why he did not decide on 2 years at a community college first. As a first generation minority, he would qualify for federal grants, state grants and possibly for a large available number of scholarships.

Going to a community college would have allowed him to build a good GPA to obtain merit based scholarships when he transfered to a 4-year college. I'm assumming that since he took out so much in loans that he did not perform very well in college (or he would have qualified for scholarships). That should have triggered a re-thinking of his goals based on the cost of college and his potential to make huge wads of cash.

I've seen people with practically no money and no special skills going to college to study American Literature with no intention of becomming a college professor. They leave college with no more ability to take care of themselves than when they started and now have a huge debt. That is just stupid.

I bet if we made colleges pay the bad debt of students such as the one described above, they'd start making sure students had a good plan for the major they are taking and know that they will be able to pay back their debt. They wouldn't let a person take out $40,000 in loans for a BS in Law Enforcement. They'd tell him to come up with a better plan and apply next year.

You're talking about merit-based scholarships for racial minorities. Who is paying for those?

If college loans were risky for the college, they would make fewer loans. But yes, the result would be a drop in majors such as Psychology and Education.

mj- being a cop has never paid well?? That is semantics- the average patrolman makkes 55-75000/yr after only three years duty! After twenty, they are making $85-120,000/yr! And most are allowed to retire in their forties, immediately recieve a paycheck that is almost full pay, and double dip...it is one of the best jobs in the US! Who are you trying to fool?

"Being a cop is a very noble profession but it's never paid all that well."

Thats nonsense....policemen in some communities make very good salaries and with very generous benefits that allow them to retire after 30 years with a pension.

I have seen a couple comments regarding colleges being resonsible for loan debt that students leave school with. I work in financial aid at a private two year college in Ohio. Students could leave here with $12,000 in loan debt. They choose to leave here with $30,000 (for an associate degree!!) because they want money while they are attending school. I talk until I'm blue in the face about how they shouldn't do it, how they will never be able to find an entry-level job in their field to be able to afford a $360 a month loan payment, etc. They do it anyway and I cannot stop them because the federal government does not allow me to. It is in our federal regulations. Also, we are responsible for the loan debt that students leave here with. They have many rules in place for this and these could close the college or take away certain majors. I know contradicting right??!! People need to start taking responsibility for their own actions.

Scooby Doo: My husband is not a minority. It is my understand that federal funding typically pays salary's for minorities, particularly in government positions. That is where is makes it difficult for a Caucasian male to get a government position. Often times, in Minnesota, we see ads for police officers that state "Minorities and women encouraged to apply" YOu can imagine this is very discouraging to those that have also put in the time and training. Its not that he wasn't a good student (he was top of his academy class and Magna Cum Laude).

The loan money didn't seem like such a problem when we started out. At that time, the economy was not forcasted to be in recession for as long as it has. Further, it seems the poor economy took a bit longer to effect government jobs, which is clearly evident in President Obama's decision to freeze government raises/promotions.

And yes, Rock760945, you are correct. Police salaries are typically higher than most would think. In Minnesota, and it seems around the nation, the average starting salary is $40,000 with minimally 80% pension after 25 years-- not a bad deal and certainly better than healthcare jobs like nursing.

It seems foolish to get a 4year over a 2year, however, in Minnesota, we have much higher/rigid standards than most states. I believe the only state that is as strict with their officer training is Colorado. In most states, you enter a police academy (paid for by the department, once you are "hired".

In Minnesota, you are required to take what is called SKILLS (police academy) before you can even be licensed by the Minnesota Peace Officer Standards Board-- SKILLS alone cost $5000 plus the amount of full-time work lost because SKILLS was a full-time (40+ hours per week) commitment. Make sense all?

I have sent a letter to our university recommending they cut back on the amount of students they are admitting to the law enforcement major every semester (typically 150+ student per semester). Perhaps fewer students and more admission competition at the university level would alleviate some of the post-graduation angst felt by the class of 2010.

Ummmm...that whole thing about "women and minorities are encouraged to apply"? Is federally mandated and it is what you will see on all job advertisements for any kind of government work. When I was a secretary for an engineering firms, all of our advertisements for bids said the same thing. Because they were paid for using government funds. Which is not at all the same as the government paying for the salaries of minority or female candidates. Certainly there are some grants from the federal government that pay for diversity hiring, but it's not what you're thinking it is.

And while there are pockets of places where officers make decent salaries, many of them are making those decent salaries only because they're doing all the over-time they can get. If you're an officer in a metro department, you'll make more. In NV, 15 years ago, my husband made $36,000 starting and easily made closer to $60,000 by offering to hold-over or come in early whenever he was called. If you're an officer in a smaller, more rural department, you'll make less...and will often need to work a part-time job to make ends meet, as friend's husband does in MO community with a population of 15,000. (His salary is $25,000/year)

And according to this...you and your husband were misinformed about the requirements to be an officer in Minnesota, like you're misinformed about who pays salaries of officers:

http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/police/recruiting/becoming.asp

I've recently completed a PhD but all along the way I was extremely careful about the amount of money I took in loans, knowing that things and times change. I'll soon start paying back a little over $22,000 in student loans, which is an appropriate amount for my field.

Bridget

i don't know what your degree is in but since you live in MN I'll go out on a limb here and suggest you try WY and COLO and MT. I know policeman does not equal guard but i do know that the WY State Prison is always looking for help and educated help is a plus. There are generally a lot of small towns here looking for officers. The energy industry also seems to bring us homeland (in)security monies that help pay law enforcement employees. The same is true of CO, MT, and if you wish UT.

I hope that helps more than being told by those who don't know you made a bad choice.

Good luck to you both.

Bridget

i don't know what your degree is in but since you live in MN I'll go out on a limb here and suggest you try WY and COLO and MT. I know policeman does not equal guard but i do know that the WY State Prison is always looking for help and educated help is a plus. There are generally a lot of small towns here looking for officers. The energy industry also seems to bring us homeland (in)security monies that help pay law enforcement employees. The same is true of CO, MT, and if you wish UT.

Also look into park service, fish and game, and forest service on fed, state, & local levels

I hope that helps more than being told by those who don't know you made a bad choice.

Good luck to you both.

Bridget: Anchorage Alaska is a great beautiful city and similar to Minneapolis but with less crime and excellent police pay- and no taxes...and they pay you to live there- they also pay nurses very well. You and your husband? I would move in a second...

Congratulations on your success BadgeBunny. Unfortunately the reality is that student loans are used for more than tuition but also to cover living expenses. SChool in a small town means most jobs for college students pay minimum wage, which doesn't always make ends meet. Lucky for you that you could get by on $22000.

Thanks to those who've provided positive feedback. We are currently looking at moving out of state. A tough decision as I have found a wonderful job with my PR degree at a great company; in order for me to find work, we would need to be near a large city. We are currently looking at Virginia; I'm confident I might find something there with degrees in History and PR.

I guess we'll end up where fate takes us. Thanks for the good luck wishes!

Bridget: Face it! You two made a bad choice w/o doing your homework. You're not alone, but it doesn't make it any less palatable.

I'm wondering why the snot remark about nursing. I can get a job any time I want-days, evenings, night, prn (as needed), part-time, weekends. See my post just above yours. I live in Ohio. I can get a job in Minnesota tomorrow. My niece, an R.N. who lives just S. of the Mayo Clinic, came for dinner last night as she's visiting her father for a wk. & we discussed jobs as her sons are having trouble.

I wouldn't hold my breath on ANYTHING PROMISSED by the govern. The days of "double-dipping" are over & our country just simply can't afford it anymore. The days of majoring in "Underwater-basket-weaving" are GONE!

P.S. The State Patrolman across the road takes extra shifts to make ends meet & he's been a State for at least 18 yrs.

To say it was "luck" absolves me of my responsibility for having created the situation, Bridget. I worked hard to ensure that what I owe for my education would be commiserate with what I would make. I scrimped, saved, and sacrificed to be where I am. I made decisions that have led me to this point.

Almost forgot. I just came back from VA (D.C. area) & although the pay is good there for almost anything, the living expenses are higher than in MN. Almost everything there is either govern. jobs or gov. related. Don't know about PR/History jobs, but my youngest in electronics/security makes an obscene amt. of $, which accounts for my suggestion of health care or electronics. His firm is private but works essentially gov. work. My other works in both health care /computers in a Medicare position-involving both disciplines.

Good Luck!

I apologize if you feel my remark towards nursing was snotty. That was not my intent.

I think the overall issue here is that this is a touchy subject due to the overall economy. When we began college three/four years ago, we did not expect the economy to stay slumped for as long as it has. I think this is the case across the nation and just limited to any specific industry.

For anyone that could make ends meet on minimum wage at a grocery store with a full time class schedule and time for homework, I applaud you and your courageous life decisions. However, for those of us that did not see the economy in the crystal ball, we are now paying the price.

My point is, university financial advisers should offer more insight as should campus career counselors. If you are a career counselor or financial aid adviser and already take this approach, I am not attacking you. I am simply saying my particular college, Minnesota State University-mankato, did not take that approach.

Why is that when anyone states their story or their opinion, readers take that as their queue to attack and defend their own choices?
I did not post this thread to create a debate around law enforcement degrees or money management. My husband and I are simply a couple of twenty-something's trying to make it work; like many other twenty-something's with shiny new degrees and little hope of finding a job without scratching and clawing for one.

Of course this begs the question... do you have a degree yourself. One can be an idiot with or without a degree. Many justify their feelings and insecurities by your type of comment.

Yes I drank the college cool aid. It took a very long time to get out from under that debt. After all that is what the article was about wasn't it? Shame on me for venting and shame on you for trying to psychoanalyze me.

I have an ASEE, a 2.5 year degree. I'm 54 hours away from a BS, but never felt the need. College degrees are good for about five years or so. After that, experience trumps education.

Sure there are companies that demand degrees, but if you are good, you can always find work through the "old boy network". That's how most jobs are filled anyway, particularly in tough times. In my entire 35 year career, I've been out or work twice, seven months, and ten months. Both I've considered vacations. Most all of my jobs were from referrals from previous co workers.

I'd also agree, there are many educated idiots out there. The problem is confusing education with intellegence. You can study and memorize well and get good grades. That does not make you a good employee. Being able to apply your knowledge to a vast array of real life problems makes you an asset.

On average college helps, but the best programmer at one company I worked was an out of work drywall hanger that got a temp job as a software tech. Working around the lab he learned "C" language and turned out to be a natural. Needless to say he never had to hang another sheet again! I've never forgotten that guy and it always reminds me to not to prejudge someone by what he does or how educated he is.

we are falling way behind europe and canada as far as educated professionals because we dont provide university for our children. We will continue to import degreed foreigners to take the positions that our own children are unqualified for, and we will continue to fall behind as long as universities are for profit.

Wrong. We are loosing educated professionals to Eurpean countries where there are more job opportunities for many educated professionals.

i wouldnt say that is "wrong", omniscient one, i would say it is symbiotic.

Not everyone is capable of attending college and probably shouldn't.

I agree, too many kids start college with no clue what they want to do. Build up thousands of dollars in debt and never finish. I am a strong advocate for Junior colleges or technical schools. I believe there has to be some type of post secondary education, but too much emphasis is put on getting a degree, and that simply is not obtainable for all students.

I would also agree. Too often, people get a degree then try to figure out what to do with it. They should decide what they want to do first, then get the minimum education they need to get in the door.

After about five years a college education is only a piece of paper and experience, and referrals are far more important. As a previous hiring manager, I never looked at the degree, just experience, and references.

In other words, do they have expertise in the area we are looking for and have they applied that expertise successfully. Personal referrals trump almost everything else. That's why networking is so critical.

A degree in a field of engineering is much different than a degree in History or Communication. Nobody is saying not to go to college to get a physics, or in your case a mechanical/electrical/chemical engineering, degree. The problem is these people taking on huge debt loads for degrees that don't lead to jobs.

You would think you would want to make it better for following generations...a government has a vested interest in educating a work force; even Madison pointed out that the US should pay for the university of worthy students...so much for our founders not being socialist, lol.

So my BA, double Major in Classics and Anthropology, with a minor in History (focus on methodology, historiography and theory) which led to my MA in Archaeology at University College London (one of the top archaeology programs, if not the top, in the world) was a waste of money?

So because you don't deem my field important I wasted my money and my time?

People with history degrees can go on to study law and politics, both important professions. They are also the ones running our museums, protecting our heritage, and educating our youth. Communication degrees are a vital part of politics and business.

Our degrees are not unemployable, they are not a waste of time or a waste of money.

I feel the same way. I'm getting my masters in social work. All of the people on this message board can degrade social workers and the amount of pay we get until it's their turn at the unemployment line and they need services, i.e.- food stamps, affordable health care, housing, help paying hospital bills b/c the unemployment benefits you have are about to run out, etc. Who do you think provides all of this for you?

If you two are happy with your choices and view them as your bliss, then go for it. But, don't complain if you have to take decades to pay back the loans or you can't find work.

Just be realistic that, like it or not, the hard sciences, electronics, mechanical, biological, etc. engineering are far more in demand and therefore far more valuable.

I can read history from a book and I've never needed a social worker but I love my TV, computer, cell phone, broadband internet, and the medicine I take to stay healthy.

Your degrees are not a waste of time for the the few people who are able to snag one of the dwindling opportunities that exist. But honestly how many Comm/History majors do I see working at Dunkin Donuts? Lots sadly.

Your comment reeks of bitterness.

The point of this article should be that college is too expensive, and only getting more so, and as such, the payoff is decreasing. College was $12 a credit when my parents went to school, now it is several hundred per credit. It's ridiculous.

You sound very angry. Do you have student loans too...it's ok don't be ashamed.

I generally noticed with my own relatives, half sisters and other people my age that I work with. If your parents told you everything when you were younger you had no reason to think. This was further compounded by endless video games and TV. I had to buy my nintendo games if I wanted them. The same with a television, got one used when I was 10 for 50 bucks. The kids end up with no individual thoughts, concepts of money, and need to be entertained somehow. Being almost 28, parents need to stop infantizing their kids. Remove the TV and the internet. Take the youngest members of my family, half sister (20) and my cousin (18) have no opinions or thoughts. They maintain there life as a perpetual distraction and have never had a self thought of what are their interests, what am I going to do with my life, or anything. Parents need to learn that giving them everything doesn't help or promoting their perpetual distractions that is the phone, video games, tv or the internet is part of their downfall. If you don't take the time to say, hey I have to pay for school and do something. You'll come out whining I have 15k in debt with no skills whatsoever. They'll just get their parents to pay it. Cut the chord. I'm tempted to say, you cant fix stupid.

time honored?? College students from "the greatest generation" got theirs paid for....by the GI BILL. The whole capitalist bootstrap argument is a myth.

Excuse me, but the "greatest generation" EARNED their GI Bill by going to war and dying for America. If they had not done what they did, you might not be around to criticize them for having supported your young booty.

Ooo that chip must weigh a ton. It took me years to finish college because I worked full time raised a family and still ended up with a huge chunk in student loans. This problem can't be solved with a cookie cutter solution and putting everyone in the same box is not helpful.

That GI bill excuse is BS. I got mine the old fashioned way as well, working summers, and getting small student loans. When my wife and I were first married, six months before graduation, we ate Kraft Mac and Cheese, (19 cents a box at the time!), six nights a week, and split a steak on Saturday night for protein.

If you sacrifice early on, you are rewarded with a far less stressful life. Debt = stress!

And pardon my typos.

Community is great for most people. The only problem is people don't ask themselves how will this benefit my life. You always need drama teachers and everything. Higher education is affordable. You just have to work. Community is like 90-100 a credit hour. Take 1-2 courses, no one needs to go full time. Just realize its not hs and its pathetic if you live off your parents. You are a real champion because you got someone else to foot your bill. Ever try and go dating in the past 5 years. I refused to date any woman who mooched off their parents. I'd go out to coffee and find out they live at home or didn't pay any bills. I jetted. I ended up going for an older women in her mid 30s. I felt sorry for the chumps at work who married who both married chics that lived with her rents. Any girl that can't handle the concept of a budget, paying bills and says screw you and pulls the mortgage money so she can get herself a new purse, is my generation and our future. The men are sissies, this mentality I discussed and the breakup of family for monetary reasons are the downfall of our country. We expect teachers to teach kids everything like, morals, ethics, classwork, home economics, life skills like cooking, etc. Then get upset when they dont. How messed up are you. Keep chasing the dollar for that tv life, its not real.

Totally agree with pookiesmommy-1401195. Those in public service jobs are the lowest in pay yet we are required to get ADVANCED degrees, while those who are in engineering jobs can make more money than what we do with a Bachelor's, yet we both have the same amount of debt. Colleges should do better. I think that what's going on with this economy is that people are being more smart about the way they do things, but it's also making us bitter.

Read "The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America"

It is a great book. I did some fact checking and found it to be an accurate book.

Not only does it explain a whole lot about our educational system but the facts are scary.

It is free in a pdf format ---google it.

sorry for typos my keys are horribly sticky and i catch what I can

RJ---

How messed up am I?? Let's see...

I have not lived with or accepted help from my parents since I was 17. I worked full time and went to school full time during all three of my degrees. And as far as dating in the past 5 years, ummmm no. I've been married for 13 to a cop. Not breakup of marriage here. We are both public servants. Both jobs required degrees. I guess possibly you could find fault with the fact we like to eat, live in a modest home, drive used cars, and raise our two kids to the best of our ability. Hmmmmm.....I guess you're right that is certainly the TV life. Life might have been easier had we made better choices. I would CHOOSE to be independently wealthly. I might also have chosen to have parents who thought about saving money for my education. I certainly would have chosen NOT to work full time while in school, especially with the two advanced degrees. Sadly, those choices were not mine to make. DEGREES= JOB, JOB=EAT.

And got someone else to foot my bill?? ARE YOU NUTS?? I am paying back every red cent with interest. And last I checked, you don't become a teacher by going to community college alone.

However, as you do so wonderfully point out..."We expect teachers to teach kids everything like, morals, ethics, classwork, home economics, life skills like cooking, etc. Then get upset when they dont..." but society and the government expects those same teachers to be well educated and "highly qualified" to do this job, but do it on a salary that is no where near enough to cover what we have invested. And if every person who ever wanted to be a teacher took your advice of weighing how a teaching career and the education it involves impacts only their life, well, then I fear there would no longer be any teachers.

Regardless of your or my personal feeling about student debt, it's obvious our higher education system is broken. Nowhere in the world does it cost more to go to college than the US. Maybe there is a correlation between that and the decline of the US as a world leader. Just a thought.

I guarantee this is because there is an overabundance of teachers. In a buyers market, they can continue to ratchet up the requirements because there is a surplus. It's just another way to whittle down the number of people to interview. If there were a shortage of teachers you would see a lowering of standards. It's simple supply and demand. This happens in all fields.

Again, the cost of education has been inflated by cheap loans, just like the cost of housing.

Thanks!

I'm sorry VV but this just isn't true. There are plenty of jobs out there. The problem is no one wants to do the "hard stuff". When I was in college the first time it was a badge of honor to be studying something in the hard sciences. You were considered the creme de la creme. Now no one wants to work that hard. They want to sail through school partying and going to Barbados over spring break then complain when they don't have a six figure salary to cover the 100k in loans they ran up in school while studying basket weaving underwater. boo! hoo! Guess what- all those foreign kids come to the US because we do have the best colleges in the world. And guess what they study- medicine and engineering and computer science. We need OUR kids to study those things again and we'll be competitive again. Pull your heads out of the sand and stop trying to be Jerseylicious or play for the Lakers. It ain't gonna happen for most of you.

I beg your pardon but it is true. I have a Master's degree in Finance and Economics, and I have been unemployed for over a year. I am also an expert with systems integration, I know many computer applications too. I've worked in every industry, aerospace, health care, manufacturing, banking, services. I've been laid off 4 times in the past ten years. I am volunteering at a friend's start-up business to keep my mind active and hopefully cut my resume in half. Of course, a lot of it is age discrimination, I will be 50 in February. But once again, THERE ARE NO JOBS! No one will hire me.

Perhaps I'm mistaken but there was a real bias against the hard sciences in the last decade or two. This led to a lot of MA degrees; teachers, accountants, etc. What seems to be happening is there is now a glut of these soft degrees, and a shortage of the hard science degrees. I think that may be why engineers are still in demand while business degreed people, like yourself, face a lot of competition.

If this is indeed the case, you're basically screwed until a real recovery takes place or many of your competition change careers. It's not too late for you to go in a different direction if you have the drive.

Yes, pretty much I'm screwed. But I intend to retool my career with some (more) computer science courses. I wish that I had gone into pure sciences, I was one of the top ten math students in Connecticut. I could have been rich if I had gone to school as a computer geek, I could have invented the internet! Alas, I chose business, what a mistake.

yes jayMan007 get a degree in something that uses market advantage and sales to steal from your desperate fellow man...bravo! Really...a banker spouting morality? lmao!

How is providing financial services to people who need them a moral issue? Not all bankers are corrupt.

So Humanities and Social Sciences are a waste of time and money to you? Did you ever consider that the people who study those fields (and yes I am one, double major BA in Classics and Anthropology with a Minor in History and a MA in Archaeology from the #4 university in the world and #1 archaeology program, UCL) just want to work in a field that they feel passionate about? They care more about jobs that mean something to them then being rich? I worked for the government for 3 years after completing my BA and was earning $42k per year, I hated my job. No I earn enough to pay my bills, but I LOVE what I do! I learn something new everyday. I'm happy. And I, like the engineer and business/accountant graduate also have no pity for those under $25k in debt when finishing. And yes, I worked all through college between 20-30 hrs on top of a full course schedule and commuting an hour to school to save money on bills and work.

Imv77: Nothing wrong with your fields of study, just that we don't NEED so many of them. There is NO student counseling in H.S.'s anymore that I can tell. I graduated from one of the highest ranked public schools in our State & we had full-time counselors-3 of them! This was in the 60's.

Priorities need to be taken into account-do I want to make a lot of money, or do I want to do something that traditionsally won't make me rich?

Hubby graduated from a dinky little school ( 20 in graduating class ), son of a coal miner who became a Master Electrician, 1st. in his family to be college educated, worked full-time for 4 yrs. taking a full load & managed to graduate Summa Cum Laude.

I wasted 3 semesters not knowing what I wanted to do, quit ( the usual MRS before the BS in those days), married, raised 2 terrific sons & went back to nursing school. Bloody tough-math, science, etc. Altho retired now, I have an R.N., BSN. & an M.S. Again, priorities AND maturity. Many of my friends did the same thing & are happier having waited to get their education.

Again, college isn't for everyone. The term used, used to be "College Material" & frankly it hasn't changed; the colleges as businesses have.

Yes, it's amazing that people will pay $50,000 - $100,000 for a degree then be incensed that their field is not appreciated. If you are impassioned by what you do that's great! Just don't be angry if others aren't as appreciative.

I think electronics is great, my wife thinks nursing is great. Neither may float your boat.

i agree..that college is about developing you mind and broadening your worldview..and not exactly about job training...

but the problem with debt...should concern everyone...these college students are the most indebted students in the US history..and when we are unable to pay for our loans..get ready for another recession

Thank you!!! Thank you!! Thank you!!!!

FINALLY someone else who understands what higher EDUCATION is about!!! I'm so tired of people, who by the way usually don't have an education, telling my that I wasted my time and money because of what my degrees are in. If I wanted to get a high paying job out of my degree, I would have gone to a trade school. I wanted to LEARN!

If higher education is only about the joy of learning, (a lofty opinion to be sure), then don't complain about the price. If one is only there to learn, you can always just buy a used text book and perhaps ask a friend to tape a lecture. Learning does not need a degree, if it is truly for it's own sake.

Most people go to school because they think they have to in order to be employed. Since degrees are required for more and more careers they are right in most cases. The issue for them is how to pay for it, and payback scenarios are indeed a valid concern.

So keep on learning and packing on the debt, or do you have some rich relative to pay for it all. In a few years down the line and another 60k in debt, lets see how much you just want to 'learn'.

Yeah it's definitely showing the front of Higgins, but it must be an old picture because it doesn't show the Saint Ignatius statue.

you're unemployed and going to study in China to study for a full year?

tell me how are you paying this...through a government sponsored language program...cause I would love to do that..and if i can apply somewhere..i will

That sucks. I took calc in highschool too and after passing the AP calc exam I was actually able to start with calc 2 my freshman year. I would have been furious if they tried to require me to take (or pay for the test to get out of) intro algebra.

That's scary. He could've paid for a single family home in some states and gotten a lower interest rate for that amount. Insane!